141 replies to this topic

[Slater]

OK, so I installed the IPD sway bars on my car last night (rear only for now - I have other plans for the front).

IPD advertises their bar as a 22mm bar, and my micrometer verified - 22.45mm.

Well guess what - I measured my stock sway bar and it is 22.51mm. Now, the slight difference is due to the thickness of the paint. The point is that the stock T-5R was supposed to come with a 20.8mm rear bar.

And no the previous owner did not have an aftermarket bar on there. It's bone stock just like it rolled out of the factory.

I wondered why I felt ZERO difference when I changed out the sway bar. I WOULD feel the difference between a 20.8 and 22mm bar (22mm sway bar is 125.15% stiffer than a 20.8mm sway bar).

That pissed me off because it throws a wrench into my plans and wasn't exactly the cheapest thing I've ever bought...

Something fishy is going on, and I haven't figured out what yet. My micrometer is correct. I have a feeling the sway bar sizes everyone has been quoting for all of the different models and years is incorrect. Which doesn't make any sense because I'm sure the list was compiled directly from Volvo information.

- Slater

[Plan_B]

I put the IPD bars on my car two weeks ago, I have noticed a huge difference in teh handeling and the preformance.


I am sorry you are having these issues.

[shaun]

OK, so I installed the IPD sway bars on my car last night (rear only for now - I have other plans for the front).

IPD advertises their bar as a 22mm bar, and my micrometer verified - 22.45mm.

Well guess what - I measured my stock sway bar and it is 22.51mm. Now, the slight difference is due to the thickness of the paint. The point is that the stock T-5R was supposed to come with a 20.8mm rear bar.

And no the previous owner did not have an aftermarket bar on there. It's bone stock just like it rolled out of the factory.

I wondered why I felt ZERO difference when I changed out the sway bar. I WOULD feel the difference between a 20.8 and 22mm bar (22mm sway bar is 125.15% stiffer than a 20.8mm sway bar).

That pissed me off because it throws a wrench into my plans and wasn't exactly the cheapest thing I've ever bought...

Something fishy is going on, and I haven't figured out what yet. My micrometer is correct. I have a feeling the sway bar sizes everyone has been quoting for all of the different models and years is incorrect. Which doesn't make any sense because I'm sure the list was compiled directly from Volvo information.

- Slater

Same thing on my car (855 t5r)- IPD unit was different but the bar that did the work was the same dia as the stock unit.

[Zappo]

Grant, you put them front and rear, so you would notice the difference.

So far, I have only done my rear bar, and I found exactly the same thing. It seemed to be almost the same size. I didn't have a micrometer, I used a 22mm wrench. After I installed it, I couldn't tell a difference at all.

That said, the IPD bar is constructed better than the stock one. Mounting points are much beefier.

[Plan_B]

Grant, you put them front and rear, so you would notice the difference.

So far, I have only done my rear bar, and I found exactly the same thing.  It seemed to be almost the same size.  I didn't have a micrometer, I used a 22mm wrench.  After I installed it, I couldn't tell a difference at all.

That said, the IPD bar is constructed better than the stock one.  Mounting points are much beefier.

Well, I don't much about mm and whatnot, but my car handles so much better then it did before.

[Slater]

Grant, you put them front and rear, so you would notice the difference.

So far, I have only done my rear bar, and I found exactly the same thing.  It seemed to be almost the same size.  I didn't have a micrometer, I used a 22mm wrench.  After I installed it, I couldn't tell a difference at all.

That said, the IPD bar is constructed better than the stock one.  Mounting points are much beefier.

You're right - the stock one is ridiculously thin and flimsy as far as the mounting points.

I am not planning on using the IPD front bar, but rather installing poly or delrin bushings on the stock front bar. In fact, I am planning on installing the SMALLER 20mm front bar found on the base models in an effort to get rid of the ridiculous understeer. The huge 25mm IPD bar will only make it worse.

[Zappo]

You're right - the stock one is ridiculously thin and flimsy as far as the mounting points.

I am not planning on using the IPD front bar, but rather installing poly or delrin bushings on the stock front bar. In fact, I am planning on installing the SMALLER 20mm front bar found on the base models in an effort to get rid of the ridiculous understeer. The huge 25mm IPD bar will only make it worse.

Ahh. Well, I am sure you can sell the IPD front bar easily.

I am planning on installing my front bar tomorrow. After that I am sure I will notice a big difference, and probably notice even more understeer than normal.

[shaun]

Ahh. Well, I am sure you can sell the IPD front bar easily.

I am planning on installing my front bar tomorrow. After that I am sure I will notice a big difference, and probably notice even more understeer than normal.

[/quote]


What happened to my car after the IPD sways went in: It handles more neutrally with much less roll on med and high speed turns, but on slow corners the already bad traction became laughably bad and the undesteer problem got worse and my car is not even chipped yet. There is still a net gain but the open diff and lack of traction is a joke and i am not doing a 5speed swap to get a (semi) closed diff. I poked around on some nissan and honda threads that focused on handling and they put bigger sways on the rear than the front in order to maintain traction and get more neutral handling out of their fwd cars. The big rear keeps the car flat and the softer front lets the front tires find traction. Makes sense to me. Eventually I am either going to weld up a 1" rear sway, and/or when my tranny blows up get it rebuilt at a really good shop and have the diff welded closed, since the tire wear already sucks.

Edited by shaun, 01 April 2005 - 12:36 AM.

[PullMyFinger]

With the ipd rear and the stock front I had crazy amounts of oversteer. Twitchy and downright hazardous at freeway speeds. It makes for a great autocross setup though.

I'm much happier with ipds front and rear although I have not really pushed the car very hard yet. Waiting for non wet roads.

[VolFan]

My R bar was Hollow Tubbing , and the IPD bar is Solid Shaft. I also checked mine with a Dial Caliper, and it was the same. Don't forget the IPD bar is heavier

[GShyneDM]

If you can... head on underneath your car and check the measurements of your front sway bar...

Also check the rear bar that you freshly installed too

JUST to be sure...

[Slater]

With the ipd rear and the stock front I had crazy amounts of oversteer. Twitchy and downright hazardous at freeway speeds. It makes for a great autocross setup though.

I'm much happier with ipds front and rear although I have not really pushed the car very hard yet. Waiting for non wet roads.

I couldn't get mine to oversteer for anything.

[Slater]

If you can... head on underneath your car and check the measurements of your front sway bar...

Also check the rear bar that you freshly installed too

JUST to be sure...

I just did - this morning.

Freshly installed rear IPD bar = 22.45mm.

Stock rear sway bar I just removed = 22.51mm.

[VolFan]

If you can... head on underneath your car and check the measurements of your front sway bar...

Also check the rear bar that you freshly installed too

JUST to be sure...

I just did - this morning.

Freshly installed rear IPD bar = 22.45mm.

Stock rear sway bar I just removed = 22.51mm.

What about it being HOLLOW?

[Slater]

My R bar was Hollow Tubbing , and the IPD bar is Solid Shaft.   I also checked mine with a Dial Caliper, and it was the same.  Don't forget the IPD bar is heavier  

Hold on now, that would explain it.

You SURE about that? The stock bar felt awful heavy.

If that is the case then yes, the IPD bar is SIGNIFICANTLY stiffer. Unfortunately I can't calculate the difference without knowing the ID of the stock bar (if it in fact hollow).

To calculate sway bar stiffness, you take:

Larger bar diameter to the 4th power/Smaller bar diameter to the 4th power * 100 = % change in stiffness.

However that only works when comparing solid vs solid or hollow vs hollow. When you compare solid vs hollow you have an extra calculation:

After you have calculated the rate of the hollow bar based on its outside diameter (o.d.), you have to subtract the rate of a hypothetical bar that matches the inside diameter (i.d.) of the space within. To do that, you need to know the wall thickness of the hollow bar which unfortnately I don't know without cutting it apart. Although if I stop by an official NHRA track, they will have an ultrasonic wall thickness measurer (used for verifying that roll cares are not really just lighter muffler tubing of the same OD as chromoly cage tubing but at a significant weight savings - old time cheating trick).

- Slater

[Slater]

What about it being HOLLOW?

I don't know that it is. I will have to check. Sure felt solid to me. Then again, it's supposed to be 20.8mm when it's measuring over 22mm. So I am beginning to wonder if I even have a stock Volvo sway bar...

[Zappo]

My R bar was Hollow Tubbing , and the IPD bar is Solid Shaft.    I also checked mine with a Dial Caliper, and it was the same.  Don't forget the IPD bar is heavier  

Hold on now, that would explain it.

You SURE about that? The stock bar felt awful heavy.

I have heard that it is hollow also, and to me my stock one felt much lighter.

[merlin390]

drill it with the smallest bit you have, my old mountaineer had a huge sway bar but it was hollow (97 model) but on the 98 models they were same OD but SOLID. I replaced my 97 model bar with a 98 model and WOO the difference. I drilled my old bar and it was 3/16"

[Slater]

My R bar was Hollow Tubbing , and the IPD bar is Solid Shaft.    I also checked mine with a Dial Caliper, and it was the same.  Don't forget the IPD bar is heavier  

Hold on now, that would explain it.

You SURE about that? The stock bar felt awful heavy.

I have heard that it is hollow also, and to me my stock one felt much lighter.

Well, the IPD has that thickass sheet metal bracket on one side and that solid block mount on the other. That accounts for a lot of the weight difference...

I'll know soon enough. I have another way to tell if it's solid or hollow without cutting the bar open...I may just drill a tiny pinhole in the bar and see if the drillbit goes through a wall or keeps on cutting metal (welding the hole up and hit it with touchup paint afterwards).

- Slater

[Slater]

drill it with the smallest bit you have, my old mountaineer had a huge sway bar but it was hollow (97 model) but on the 98 models they were same OD but SOLID. I replaced my 97 model bar with a 98 model and WOO the difference. I drilled my old bar and it was 3/16"

You beat me to it ;0)

Yeah, the old tricks they are using to try and get better rollover ratings on SUVs...hilarious.

- Slater