48 replies to this topic

[bloc]

if this belongs in maintenance go ahead and move it...


so i searched quite a bit on this and i wanted to get information in one thread to make this go easier for people trying to do what i am..


obviously turbo 5spd cars are just about non-existant in the states, so i want to put together an index of the parts that are the same between cars, and the parts that will work off a NA car in case someone finds one locally.

obviously the shifter mechanism and cables, pedal assembly, and cvs will work for either one.

is the transmission the same between turbo and NA?

i know the turbo cars have a bigger clutch, requiring a different flywheel, but will the parts on a NA engine bolt up to the turbo engine as long as we were planning on keeping the car otherwise stock? ignore power handling at the moment, will the parts bolt up?

if the trannies are different, will the hydraulics carry over?


the writeups on this board so far, while having good detail, are not complete which is unfortunate. i planned on doing an indepth writeup if i can make this work out. the trouble is gathering all of the parts and getting this started before my autotragic totally craps out on me.


thanks for any help

Justin

[jeremy]

There are two different transmissions M56L and M56H difference being gear ratios.
The '93 to '95 trannys have a speed sensor the '96 and up do not.
I think there is a difference in the throw out bearing setup between the early and the later transmissions.
The early single mass flywheels are the same and work on turbo and n/a cars these used a sprung disc clutch.
The later cars had different clutches with dual mass flywheels and an unsprung disc.

Thats my 2 cents

[Gioseppe]

also rumored is that the m56h is stronger then the L version. gear synchros i think it was.

there's also other options, an m59(came on the 97R version with a factory lsd) and a m66 six speed from the s60r. a few people have done that/in the process. swedish mike has and our own ultra runner is currently making the swap a possibility.

[bloc]

so i did some digging in the volvo parts program.

93 US market M56L seems to have a 3.77 final drive and lower first and second gears as compared to the M56H
94 US market M56L apparently has a 4.0:1 final drive and the same ratios as the 93 L

the chart in the volvo parts program doesnt go up to 95, unfortunately. the owners manuals posted on volvo's webpage seem to think in 95 a M56H was the only standard transmission available. however someone on here has posted into about a 95 56L. not quite sure how accurate the owners manual is in this situation, but it's a safe bet it is a 4.0:1 final drive since that seemed to be the direction they were heading in 94.

in 94, the turbo cars (according to the volvo parts program) came with the M56H. this may account for the rumor that the 56H is stronger. this is practicly impossible to substantiate, but i will likely be stuffing a L into my T5 wagon soon, so we'll see how well it does with stock power.



couple thoughts.

3.77 final drive M56L results in a 2.639:1 ratio at the wheel.
4.0:1 Final drive M56L or H is 2.8:1 at the wheel

stock turbo auto box is 2.439:1 at the wheel.

so even with the 3.77 final drive you will be turning more revs than the automatic cars on the freeway.

comparing auto to manual ratios for anything lower than probably 3rd gear is pointless because of the torque multiplication of a torque converter, i just found that bit of info interesting.




what exactly is dual mass vs single mass flywheel? in 10 years of working on cars i dont remember hearing it referred to like that.

anyone have pics of the different throwout assemblies?
dimensions on the clutch packages?

fcp lists a different clutch for the R cars, and a different pilot bearing for non-turbo cars. what are the differences here?

[Karlson]

good idea justin

But I think u have to ask people who already did that swap. Search and u will find it, from top of my head, u need shifter cables, shifter, clutch cylinder and complete clutch system from pedal to pressure plate

Probably in dealership it will cost tons of money

[AnthonyR]

Parts list from my sig

M56(h or l) or M59
Brake/clutch pedal assembly
master cylinder
slave cylinder ***Buy New
hard line hose that connects the master/slave cylinder
shift box/shifter/shift boot
manual center console black piece
manual shifter linkage
throwout bearing ***Buy New
throwout fork
pilot bearing ***Buy New
manual driveshafts **Realized the auto ones work fine
850 flywheel
clutch disk
pressure plate

[Karlson]

Anthony,


how much did u pay for

master cylinder
slave cylinder ***Buy New
hard line hose that connects the master/slave cylinder
shift box/shifter/shift boot
manual center console black piece
manual shifter linkage
throwout bearing ***Buy New
throwout fork
pilot bearing ***Buy New
manual driveshafts **Realized the auto ones work fine
850 flywheel
clutch disk
pressure plate

[AnthonyR]

Anthony,
how much did u pay for

master cylinder
slave cylinder ***Buy New
hard line hose that connects the master/slave cylinder
shift box/shifter/shift boot
manual center console black piece
manual shifter linkage
throwout bearing ***Buy New
throwout fork
pilot bearing ***Buy New
manual driveshafts **Realized the auto ones work fine
850 flywheel
clutch disk
pressure plate

vsp kit - master cylinder
~100 - slave cylinder ***Buy New
vsp kit - hard line hose that connects the master/slave cylinder
vsp kit+200 (I installed EST short shift) - shift box/shifter/shift boot
vsp kit - manual center console black piece
vsp kit - manual shifter linkage
~45 - throwout bearing ***Buy New
vsp kit - throwout fork
~5 - pilot bearing ***Buy New
manual driveshafts **Realized the auto ones work fine
vsp kit+40 resurface - 850 flywheel
500 w/pressure plate - spec - clutch disk
see above - pressure plate
vsp kit - Pedal assembly

vsp (volvosaabparts) kit - 500
m56h manual trans - 600
total w short shift and spec clutch - ~2k
Although at the same time I ended up replacing various mounts and such along the way that I encountered that needed replacing.

Edited by AnthonyR, 16 March 2006 - 04:00 PM.

[bloc]

their kit gets to the heart of the details i wanted.

the vspkit will most likely be including a NA flywheel and clutch. will this setup work well on a turbo, assuming you use new clutch parts?

are the hpt (Non-R) and NA clutch setups the same?

Justin

[Karlson]

looks like there site is down

[bloc]

i havent been able to resolve volvosaabparts.com for weeks so i was assuming the site was down for some reason, till i realized no one was complaining about it being down.
today i did a whois vs network solutions' site, got the ip, browsed there as if nothing was wrong, called, got the info.

course now their IP address via NS is 1.1.1.1 which we all know isnt right.

[AnthonyR]

you can find almost all those parts new at fcp groton for not much more. Only things you can't is like the pedal assembly and the shifter assembly, which should be able to be had at almost any volvo salvage yard (like strandbergs in WI)

[bloc]

anthony,

was your spec clutch for a NA flywheel or turbo?

thanks
Justin

[Zappo]

you can find almost all those parts new at fcp groton for not much more. Only things you can't is like the pedal assembly and the shifter assembly, which should be able to be had at almost any volvo salvage yard (like strandbergs in WI)

I agree, I would probably get all the hydralic stuff from FCP instead of used.



I am also curious as to which flywheel you used.

[Karlson]

how about axle? do we need to buy manual transmision axle or automatic works?

[yangotang]

how about axle? do we need to buy manual transmision axle or automatic works?

Refer to post #6.

The manual ones are thicker from what i've heard.

[Zappo]

how about axle? do we need to buy manual transmision axle or automatic works?

Autos will work just fine. There is a visual difference between the turbo and non-turbo axles, but a lot of places don't even sell the non-turbo ones anymore since they all fit.

[trance42]

Parts list from my sig

M56(h or l) or M59
Brake/clutch pedal assembly
master cylinder
slave cylinder ***Buy New
hard line hose that connects the master/slave cylinder
shift box/shifter/shift boot
manual center console black piece
manual shifter linkage
throwout bearing ***Buy New
throwout fork
pilot bearing ***Buy New
manual driveshafts **Realized the auto ones work fine
850 flywheel
clutch disk
pressure plate

i havnt put my console back togather completly. what is the manual center console black piece.what is The shift box? and i guess i should know this but what the pilot bearing is. hopefully its not something i left out.

[Ghost Shadow]

from my sig, you will see a link to the play by play when i did my swap!

Parts list from my sig

M56(h or l) or M59
Brake/clutch pedal assembly
master cylinder
slave cylinder ***Buy New
hard line hose that connects the master/slave cylinder
shift box/shifter/shift boot
manual center console black piece
manual shifter linkage
throwout bearing ***Buy New
throwout fork
pilot bearing ***Buy New
manual driveshafts **Realized the auto ones work fine
850 flywheel
clutch disk
pressure plate