72 replies to this topic

[Che'_Moderator]

I know you did not bring it up, but from the flight deck they can decompress the cabin which is much more efficient.

why isn't that done?

Wouldn't everybody die?

No, they can drop the pressure to the point you would black out. Then decend 10,000 feet or so. At 20k your out but fine. People would come to on the landing but at that point I an sure the pilots have secured their postion and there will be a breech team waiting on the ground

pretty slick defense I hadn't considered. any evidence it is being employed in training? that is pretty fail-safe.

You know where pilots come from? Something like 85% are retired military. So in general the passengers may be sheep but the pilots are not. Hence why in a lot of hi-jackings you find the crew were killed before the crash. I have a few friends who are ex F-16 pilots who fly for NW, and I cannot see anyone taking the plane from them. Then again they also carry 44-mag and one carries a 50 cal DE with shot.

[VS Legend]

Everyone who's read or seen the lingoleers knows that.

[ontheheel]

the carry weapons that the tsa issues are law enforcement HK usp40 compacts. with nasty nasty leo-only ammo. those bullets are pretty dang nasty, and i would never want to be the recipient of one of those.

i got to use an automatic pistol for the fist time this weekend. all i can say, is that it is definitley wierd. i'm used to shotguns and rifles being supported by my shoulder, so supporting the gun with my hands was odd. also, the first trigger pull is soooo long, but for what it's used for, that's good because you make up most of that distance during the draw. i'm just used to my 2 lb pull on my rifle, so it was difficult staying steady squeezing off a round while i was waiting for the hammer to click. but the double action remedies that after the first shot

allthough he grew up in a military family, he wasn't military. he got his in by being a bush pilot in alaska. you know, using frozen rivers as runways in heavy fog, etc.

Edited by ontheheel, 02 November 2004 - 07:35 PM.

[Che'_Moderator]

40 is a really weak round, as far as stopping power. The history of it is even weak. It was chambered because the FBI needed a round that women could handle. As for 44mag, he is a die hard wheel gun fan. With that said, everything is 5 or 6 rounds so......

Also as an FYI LEO is not the best ammo. A lot of LEO ammo was made to be underpowered so it would not over penetrate for liabality reasons. Typical LEO issue here is SXT, formally black talons, or a lot issue glaser.

[Che'_Moderator]

Thanks for the heads up. I was comparing 9, 40 and 45 and the ballistics for 40 looked pretty darn close to 45ACP. Intresting to say the least... lots of stuff to consider.

Ballistics is weird stuff. A standard load 9mm is pretty weak compared to a normal .45 load. But if you look at case pressure and barrel pressure you can load a 9mm way up, were as a .45 does not have the ability to be loaded as hot. If you go by factory load .40 is a good load. .40 was a 10mm loaded down though. 10mm has almost 50% more power. .41ae is also a very nice round. If you stay in the limits of standard reloading tables you can get a 9mm up to 470 lb/ft if your talking para not markov. A really really hot .45 might get you up to 590 ft/lb. .40 will load up to about 490ft/lb. .41ae makes in the low 600s. 10mm will make over 700 ft/lb though. Almost twice what a 9mm makes and right around what a hot .357 mag makes. Bigger is always better if you can handle it. ß My motto in life

[Che'_Moderator]

Sweet bud Always good info!!

Dad's been getting back into loading ALOT lately. He's been toying with the idea of a new S&W 500

Wont be the only thing I own, so I may consider a 40 just for kicks. I already have 45's and can load those, might be intresting. I can't carry legally anyways (right now) so all out man stopping ability isnt the first priority.

hmmmm

Tell him shoot it first. The 500sw is a stupid round IMHO. Its like saying for street use a 400hp volvo is good, than a 3000hp volvo must be better. I shoot .50AE alot with no problems but 500sw really hurts my hands. If hes getting it just to say he has it, go for it!!! If he actually wants a shooter, get something else.

I mean come on. Pistols are not supposed to come with slings. Weapons like this are why we need firearm control

[Che'_Moderator]

<--- thoughts exactly lol

He was looking at it w/ the 4" barrel. The one we shot (a buddy has one) w/ a good set of hogue grips was no worse than shooting a SW framed 44mag.

What rounds? Full loads or some of the weaker stuff thats showing up? Just buy a 30mm and atleast have the ful ato option

[laird]

the only problem with depressurizing the cabin is those pesky ogygen masks the automatically deploy. Negative Gs are an option but you may paste half of the passengers on the ceiling. I have sat in the jump seat of many airlines and when shave and a haircut knocks on the door, the pilot opens up and thats that. any nice guy in the first ten rows could figure that out within 5 minutes. things are much different now I am sure, no one rides jumpseat, at least no air traffic controllers, and they likely have a new knock.

[ontheheel]

the only problem with depressurizing the cabin is those pesky ogygen masks the automatically deploy. Negative Gs are an option but you may paste half of the passengers on the ceiling. I have sat in the jump seat of many airlines and when shave and a haircut knocks on the door, the pilot opens up and thats that. any nice guy in the first ten rows could figure that out within 5 minutes. things are much different now I am sure, no one rides jumpseat, at least no air traffic controllers, and they likely have a new knock.

you are right about the oxygen masks, but you know what, they aren't portable. you would have to take a deep breath in one, do what you want to do, and run back to refill your lungs...