33 replies to this topic

[PyROTech]

So some background (btw im not explaining everything).

In canada a number of years ago some wonderful politicians reacted to mass murders (actually im not entirely sure the actual reason, its debatable the motives) by requiring all guns to be registered (not just once but renewing and paying money every number of years). This registry was supposed to be fairly cheap but ended up over a billion dollars (dont actually know this for fact). Fuck it, im posting the wiki page b/c im lazy...
http://en.wikipedia....rearms_Registry

"The Canadian Firearms Registry is part of the Firearms Act and is managed by the RCMP Canadian Firearms Program. It requires the registration of all guns in Canada. It was introduced by the Liberal government of Prime Minister Jean Chrétien and implemented by successive Justice Ministers Allan Rock and Anne McLellan. It requires all usable firearms in Canada to be registered. This was an effort to reduce crime by making every gun traceable. The annual operating cost of the program is reported to be $44.6 million.^[1]

Any person wishing to obtain a firearm must first acquire a Possession and Acquisition Licence or PAL.^[2] The PAL carries a fee of $60 for non-restricted, $80 for restricted, and is renewable every five years. Expiry dates are set on the holder's birthday following the fifth anniversary of the initial issue of the licence.

After a change in government in 2006, the current Conservative Federal Government announced amnesty to all rifle and shotgun owners facing prosecution for failing to register their firearms, with an extended amnesty currently set to expire on May 16, 2011.^[3] Since its introduction in 2001 and continuing on to the present, the long-gun registry remains a contentious issue in Canadian politics."




"


Cost overruns
The registry again became a political issue in the early 2000s when massive cost overruns were reported.

In December 2002, the Auditor-General of Canada, Sheila Fraser, reported that the project was running vastly above initial cost estimates. The report shows that the implementation of the firearms registry program by the Department of Justice has had significant strategic and management problems throughout. Taxpayers were originally expected to pay only $2 million of the budget while registration fees would cover the rest. In 1995, the Department of Justice reported to Parliament that the system would cost $119 million to implement, and that the income generated from licensing fees would be $117 million. This gives a net cost of $2 million. At the time of the 2002 audit, the revised estimates from the Department of Justice were that the cost of the program would be more than $1 billion by 2004/05 and that the income from licence fees in the same period would be $140 million.

The causes of the cost overruns have been blamed on the inexperience of the Justice Department in managing a project of such scale. Especially crucial was that the scope of the project was in continuous flux requiring continuous changes to the basic set-up of the registry.<sup>[citation needed]"




So, a vote is coming in the canadian government on wether to get rid of the registry or not. What you guys think?</sup>

I believe, that you would still be required to register restricted firearms (hand guns...) and still have a license but not register your rifles.

[Che'_Moderator]

Its pays for your crapy healthcare so embrace the dark side hippy.

[flyfishing3]

i didn't vote, but i believe every gun, no matter which, should be blue printed.

now, i'm also for no semi auto's to the public but thats a different arguement.

[Che'_Moderator]

flyfishing3, on 18 September 2010 - 03:25 PM, said:

i didn't vote, but i believe every gun, no matter which, should be blue printed.

now, i'm also for no semi auto's to the public but thats a different arguement.

Whos paying for that?

[flyfishing3]

Pay to play

[PyROTech]

no semi autos? or did you mean full auto?

[flyfishing3]

As far as I know, you cannot buy a full auto here.

Everybody buys semi's and mods to full

Hense, ban semis, takes autos out of the market

[Che'_Moderator]

flyfishing3, on 18 September 2010 - 04:23 PM, said:

As far as I know, you cannot buy a full auto here.

Everybody buys semi's and mods to full

Hense, ban semis, takes autos out of the market

See this is the problem. Under educated people when it comes to laws. No offense. Full autos are completely legal here. You want an M16, here go buy one:
http://www.gunbroker...?Item=190597337

Pay to play sounds great but how is it a "Right" if you have to pay? Aside from that, who is gonna manage the information? Who is going to enforce the laws? I know in the state off Florida there has never been a murder committed with a legal full-auto. So why ban something that has never killed a single person? On the other hand I see a lot of throw down .38 revolvers killing people all over the place.

[PyROTech]

flyfishing3, on 18 September 2010 - 04:23 PM, said:

As far as I know, you cannot buy a full auto here.

Everybody buys semi's and mods to full

Hense, ban semis, takes autos out of the market

im not sure but pre ban autos are still legit in the states, same as pre restricted guns are legit here? makes the price go insanely high for those old weapons.

Your making an argument based on something someone might do, also your lumping in a massive amount of weapons into that category. Your making the assumption all semis can be converted to full auto. Im sure in everyones mind a replica ak converts to full auto really easily, yet there are several types of reloading mechanisms. By design some cant be converted into full auto. Besides that some would it completely moronic to convert, example would be a full auto hunting rifle at 500m.

[Che'_Moderator]

Under Mike's plan

Illegal


Legal

[flyfishing3]

well i'm trying to soften my NO GUNS in the public hands by just picking on SEMI's and FUll's.

i don't know all the laws obviously, i believe there needs to be a moritorium(SP) on guns.(MY BELIEF).

there are more guns than US citizens. i know guys with multiple safe's full. you can only fire two guns at a time i believe.

this is my opionion and i'm not here to argue gun rights.

[Che'_Moderator]

flyfishing3, on 18 September 2010 - 04:48 PM, said:

well i'm trying to soften my NO GUNS in the public hands by just picking on SEMI's and FUll's.

i don't know all the laws obviously, i believe there needs to be a moritorium(SP) on guns.(MY BELIEF).

there are more guns than US citizens. i know guys with multiple safe's full. you can only fire two guns at a time i believe.

this is my opionion and i'm not here to argue gun rights.

So.... ban?


And FYI Hitler imposed some of the toughest gun laws in history. Actually he started to enforce the law already in place by the Weimar government, but he cracke down.

[flyfishing3]

IMO, you can have a gun permit with your hunting license.

don't call all your gun toating buddies on me either.

Che, on 18 September 2010 - 04:52 PM, said:

And FYI Hitler imposed some of the toughest gun laws in history.

[Che'_Moderator]

flyfishing3, on 18 September 2010 - 04:55 PM, said:

IMO, you can have a gun permit with your hunting license.

Why would you say ban semi-autos was my question? If you were gonna say leave wheel guns and bolt actions legal and ban semi-autos that would mean .50bmg with shell catcher and laser right was ok, but a lot of shotguns would be illegal.

Mike's Firearm Plan


Legal!


Illegal!

[flyfishing3]

i'm basically against all guns except for hunters that have taken classes and would need proof of gun safety.

they can hunt with their blue printed guns and put them back in their safe's when done.

ok, i'm done playing. i'm off to my cabin to drink whiskey and shot semi auto guns in the air.

i can see when i get my bike off you, it will be covered in NRA stickers.

[Che'_Moderator]

flyfishing3, on 18 September 2010 - 05:01 PM, said:

i'm basically against all guns except for hunters that have taken classes and would need proof of gun safety.

they can hunt with their blue printed guns and put them back in their safe's when done.

ok, i'm done playing. i'm off to my cabin to drink whiskey and shot semi auto guns in the air.

So none for retired LEO or mil? I leave my pistols out for kids to find. One in the desk few in the kitchen and such. Its called dawrinism. They're right next to the bubblegum flavored bourbon.

[s70turbo1998]

Criminals will get their guns. It's really not that hard to get your silencer/autoload classification (at least here; i know a lot of LEO here). Gun regulation only restricts those who abide by it. I'll reevaluate this tomorrow morning

[Young Burnsy]

Mike you should move to England.

[flyfishing3]

when chuck took ECON classes instead of GUNS and BUTTER he used Semi auto and Full auto for S & D.

[PyROTech]

i read and hear so much misinformation about the gun registry thing in canada it makes me wonder why we arent already all doomed. Comments just from today.
-hand guns shouldnt be made legal in canada (they are legal yet people still think they arent)
-if we had the gun registry so many gangs wouldnt have guns to kill people (what gang member is gonna get a license, register a rifle in the first place? and just for peoples info, people with a criminal record cant have gun license nevermind legally have a gun)

So to make it clear, you still need a license to get a gun, there are 2 different licenses. One for rifles and one for restricted (hand guns basically). YOU NEED TO TAKE A COURSES! to show you know the safety rules, two separate courses for both types. You also need to take a range course on top of this, you also need to get approval to transport restricted weapons. You have to join a club before you can start with your hand guns, and there is a waiting period and demonstration they you know what you are doing. Full background check (more waiting), they contact your partners and ask them if your nuts and going to kill them, check all the times you have come into contact with police (in CPIC). Alot more crap to do with the actual license itself. Now you then have to also take hunting course and license for that. By this time your really frustrated lol with the excessive amount of time its taken. Your not finished yet. You have to now figure out your storage options, laws about this. So assuming you have gone and passed this all you can now buy depending on the order of these steps and a few minor details in between that really doesnt make a lot of sense but its needed.

So you buy your rifle, from a store that is and not private (private is different). You have paperwork galore (depending on a couple other things). You now need to keep the firearm registered continuously or its supposed jail time if you let it lapse.

A couple points, the whole needing constant registration is what they ultimately are looking at getting rid of. (The rifle, not the hand guns and other restricted weapons). We arent talking about needing all the other crap you already have to have. That still stays. semi autos have a max holding so your arent gonna be able to have banna clips lol, infact the clips themselves are illegal i believe that hold large amounts. No silencers and length is also restricted, no sawed off shotguns.