Tuners Rejoice! Free Tuning For M4.4!


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So just to get a few things straight.

The 8 bit value that you guys are seeing (that only goes up to 12.24), is only the load value used for the maps, etc.

The load value that is actually used in the fuel equation is a 16 bit number (meaning load probably goes way over 12.24).

To answer this, if boost rises, air flow will also most likely rise, and since Husseins MAF isnt clipped, this extra air flow will be taken into account and more fuel added, so most likely it will not go lean and since this is a target lambda map, as long as MAF isnt clipped it should target the AFR very close to what you tell it to.

I am not 100% sure but when I maxed load but not MAF (960 maf) AFR did get leaner when boost rise over target.

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I kept some ignition retard between 4000 and 5000 RPM, no matter how much fuel I added or how much I retarded the ingintion, I just could not get rid of it.

I have retarded my intake cam 3°.. et voila.... no more ignition retard....at all.

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Well, tiring day today!

I've put S90MAF (with all the hardware adjustments that it requires), lubricated forge CBV with vaseline (it's a little better but not perfect yet) and fitted wideband, and some suspension job too.

Piet - full trims look the same as before! :)

I've only logged 3rd gear so far and I can say this 18T with only 14/15psi is sucking 985kg/hr by 6390rpm (didn't rev higher yet) and injector DC (with greens) got up to 91% (ok, I'm still running stock S70R fuel maps which are too rich but these greens will have some big job to do when I turn up boost). I don't have the wideband being logged yet but as far as I could see these stock map really goes to high 10's AFR.

Some more testing and information next days. Real tuning is just begining now :)

Edited by S70-R
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I am not 100% sure but when I maxed load but not MAF (960 maf) AFR did get leaner when boost rise over target.

Unless you monitor inj duty and measure AFR with WB02, AND measure fuel pressure at the same time, you cannot be sure the lean condition is either injectors outflowed or fuel volume is insufficient to meet your needs at that load/boost/rpm.... If you have that data it should be reviewed to determine why your AFR's got lean. Could also just be the VE and WOT settings are not appropriate, assuming the other factors are known.

So just to get a few things straight.

The 8 bit value that you guys are seeing (that only goes up to 12.24), is only the load value used for the maps, etc.

The load value that is actually used in the fuel equation is a 16 bit number (meaning load probably goes way over 12.24).

.

Thanks for the clarification, Matt! I've been thinking about WTF to do now, if indeed that was the situation as Piet described it . Good to know my fears of fumbling in the dark again were unfounded.

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Unless you monitor inj duty and measure AFR with WB02, AND measure fuel pressure at the same time, you cannot be sure the lean condition is either injectors outflowed or fuel volume is insufficient to meet your needs at that load/boost/rpm.... If you have that data it should be reviewed to determine why your AFR's got lean. Could also just be the VE and WOT settings are not appropriate, assuming the other factors are known.

Thanks for the clarification, Matt! I've been thinking about WTF to do now, if indeed that was the situation as Piet described it . Good to know my fears of fumbling in the dark again were unfounded.

When I rescaled load problem was gone. So I am pretty sure that was the case. I cant log boost and afr but I have wideband.

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Unless you monitor inj duty and measure AFR with WB02, AND measure fuel pressure at the same time, you cannot be sure the lean condition is either injectors outflowed or fuel volume is insufficient to meet your needs at that load/boost/rpm.... If you have that data it should be reviewed to determine why your AFR's got lean. Could also just be the VE and WOT settings are not appropriate, assuming the other factors are known.

Thanks for the clarification, Matt! I've been thinking about WTF to do now, if indeed that was the situation as Piet described it . Good to know my fears of fumbling in the dark again were unfounded.

Ha,ha.... I'am very sorry for that Hussein. :blush:

I never meant to throw you in the dark like that :mellow:

Didn't know that internally the loadvalue is stored as a 16 bit word.

Edited by Piet
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Yesterday night I went to some more runs and logging.

In 4th and 5th gear with 14/15psi I'm already reading a little bit more than 1000kg/hr. I'm hitting load well above 10ms.

I didn't turn up boost yet so I'm still runing 14/15psi. However, as I have a strong WG at the moment if I immediatly give gas @ 3.300/3.500rpm or more I will have obvisouly some boost spikes arround 18/20psi and when that happens sometimes I hit high 11ms load and even 12.24ms load!

2nd gear boost spike / load 12,24ms:

12_24ms_load_2nd_gear.jpg

3rd gear boost spike / load 12,24ms:

12_24ms_load_3rd_gear.jpg

Some >1000kg/hr situations:

more_than_1000kg.jpg

Well, when I turn up boost from 14/15 psi to 18/19psi I think this maf will be maxed out. Injectors won't have an easy task too...

EDIT: Being this a 18T and being flowing this much only with this boost I can say this 2.75intake + do88 intercooler and reverse piping really allow these turbos to have much more potential.

Let's see for the data when I turn up the boost...I'm curious

Edited by S70-R
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Looks like you need to move up to the 3.25" With Piet's table, to gain some headroom. 1600 kg/h should be safely beyond what that setup will flow.

According to your last clipping, your injectors are over done. Even in the earlier screenshot, you are over 85%. Time to also move up to larger injectors before you try running more boost, seriously.

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Looks like you need to move up to the 3.25" With Piet's table, to gain some headroom. 1600 kg/h should be safely beyond what that setup will flow.

According to your last clipping, your injectors are over done. Even in the earlier screenshot, you are over 85%. Time to also move up to larger injectors before you try running more boost, seriously.

What about upping the fuel pressure to 3.8 bar, should take the injectors close to 500cc.

What AFR's are you getting, or can't you measure them yet?

As I said before, I'm still running stock S70R fuel map. I have the wideband installed but I'm not logging it yet. However, as far as I could see from the gauge in high rpms I have really low 11's and many times bellow 11's. I've already seen 10.6AFR! So, I'm running too rich yet.

I will adjust the fuel map to run low 12's/ high 11's, so I hope I can get more headroom regarding the injectors.

As Avinitlarge said, if needed, for now I would prefer to increase fuel pressure to 3.8bar and mantain the greens.

Regarding the maf, let's see but I'm sure it will be maxed. Damn.. i've just bought this maf and made all the hardware adjustments to get it fitted. For now I think I would prefer to fool the ECU by tunning the lower load cells as if they were higher load cells - it complicate things I know but to invest in another maf and hardware adjustments again....don't want it for now.

Piet, as I told you, this S70R with this 18T will probably max greens at 3bar. What a beast this car is...

By the way, this afternoon I made some experimental tuning in a fully STOCK S70R from a friend of mine and running 17psi we didn't max his stock maf.

However, there was something really strange. Even running stock fuel and ignition maps and having load up to 8.3 max we were getting some detonation (sum values reached 17degrees). We had detonation even in the 7ms load range.

Having detonation when running stock maps and not achieving higher loads than the stock ones it's odd.

It is also odd the fact that for the first time we run fully stock maps in order to see what kind of load and maf values we were getting and we didn't get more than 6.X load. According to the stock target load map we should run up to 8ms load.

Edited by S70-R
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I would first get your AFR's right and then see what max duty cycle you get.

Yes, of course that will be the first step :) however, in respect to S90MAF I think it will not be enough.

Regarding my friend's S70R I think he might have some problem regarding the turbo.

Firstly I used the bin with all the S70R stock maps and we didn't get more than 12 psi - it seems ok for the stock boost but things get really odd when:

1. With these stock maps and with 12 psi we didn't achieve the target load (max logged load was 6.X - very poor). According to the stock target load map the load should be above 8ms between 4500-5400.

2. We had some detonation with the stock maps

3. Then I raised boost up to 17psi and we finally got some 8ms load (which should be the stock load). Some detonation continued.

4. With his stock ECU (it is supposed to be fully stock and not remapped) we had 17psi of boost too (it is not supposed).

So, once I used the p-part bin and not the normal bin because I was not expecting too much of deviation between the load achieved by the TCV DC itself and the target load, I think his turbo might have some problem. Let's see:

1. It is odd he's having 17psi with the stock ECU;

2. It's odd he's having only 6.X with 12psi with the p-part bin with all the stock maps;

3. The p-part bin doesn't make the positive correction of the boost logic control, so if the load is lower than target nothing is done to the TCV DC to compensate, which explains why we only had 6.X load with stock maps and explains why we only got 8ms load with 17psi.

The problem may be the CBV leaking so the turbo spins like crazy to achieve target boost and generate some "nice" pressure in the manifold but the air mass reaching the mani is poor. CBV is always loosing air to the non pressurized side of the compressor however the air mass that can reach the mani does it with some "nice" pressure.

This seems plausible?

Of course it may be other problems but this one it's likely due to the age of the CBV. We'll inspect it and other problem sources too.

Edited by S70-R
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What about upping the fuel pressure to 3.8 bar, should take the injectors close to 500cc.

Upping the regulated pressure is really a bandaid. You will loose fuel volume up top, I know from experience - EVEN with a high flow (DW300) fuel pump. With a stock pump, not really a wise move.

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