Tuners Rejoice! Free Tuning For M4.4!


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53 minutes ago, Tightmopedman9 said:

That was just a quick idle and throttle blip from my car. Clutch still isn't working so I can't get running drive logs from it. I shouldn't have posted that, because it really makes the control look much more ineffectual than it is. 

The new routine directly replaces the stock I factor RPM vs load lookup. I quickly ditched the single axis, non RPM dependent lookup and replaced it with a AFR deviation vs RPM lookup map. The AFR deviation axis is in units of AFR and the scale of the axis is determined by your AFR gauge.

4-RH

I still need to play around with the AFR deviation axis and tuning of the factor, but the above map seems to give pretty good control of the AFR, even if the tuning of the 'VE' map isn't so spot on. At idle I find that with an I factor of 1, and the P,D variables set appropriately, the AFR will stay within .1 of the target. 

I think the next step in wideband control would be feeding the AFR into the ECU via serial input instead of analog 0-5 voltage.

I'll send the code to Piet and Venderbroeck if they want to incorporate it into their wideband regulation mod. I'd appreciate any feedback for tuning of the map. 

I definitely will give it a try 

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random question/thought: 2.3t RN engine bone stock, hx35 12cm2, e85 fuel, fmic, gonna dyno tune, not myself. what power/torque u think its safe to go for ? injectors gonna be enough for 400 on the flywheel.

random question v2: i have electronic boost gauge, 0-5v (i think, not 100% sure), so in theory, i can take signal from gauge to motronic ecu free adc and find out formula to calc pressure for loging, right ?

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On 12/3/2017 at 6:21 PM, orangecucumbers said:

Hi All.

I have been using Tunerpro to flash my ecu for some time now, I have finally upgraded to an ostrich 2.0
I have searched through the majority of these 454 pages and cannot find what I am looking for.

I can connect to the ostrich and can upload and download bins no problem but cannot get the car to run.

What I have noticed is if I upload a bin (I can verify it at this stage and get a pass), then download the bin immediately (I can again verify it at this stage and get a pass) the values have changed?  A good example is Injection Basic Adjustment Factor, I enter it in as .8125, upload, then download and the value is now 0.0469...

What am I doing wrong?

Any help would be greatly appreciated. 

I am completely stumped here.  what could I be doing wrong?

 

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Afaik, downloading the bin from the Ostrich doesn't properly work to begin with. At least it hasn't worked yet for me - I just upload and when in doubt will hit "verify". If it passes that, you can be sure the values are in your bin properly.

Downloading corrupts the bin for me somehow. I don't think my car would run when I re-flash a downloaded bin. 

Upload a fresh, known good bin in there and see if it starts. If it doesn't, re-check the soldered wiring of the ostrich onto your ECU. 

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2 hours ago, Boxman said:

Afaik, downloading the bin from the Ostrich doesn't properly work to begin with. At least it hasn't worked yet for me - I just upload and when in doubt will hit "verify". If it passes that, you can be sure the values are in your bin properly.

Downloading corrupts the bin for me somehow. I don't think my car would run when I re-flash a downloaded bin. 

Upload a fresh, known good bin in there and see if it starts. If it doesn't, re-check the soldered wiring of the ostrich onto your ECU. 

ok cool.  will try that :)

Thanks

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can`t download MIL Flash - 608 - x64.exe file, forum don`t let me. any way this could be uploaded somewhere like google drive for example ? also, i`m a bit confused, is it ok to use tcv map for boost control with ldr routines disabled without caring about target load map ? or is it still essential, after tcv map is sorted out, for safety reasons ? also, could someone post some screenshots from logs on part load and WOT when using wideband control mod ?

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Disabling LDR would be the safety reason in itself, imo. Simplest way to avoid boost spikes, which are caused solely by the LDR routine. Afaik you can tweak it such that it only lowers boost and never raises it, think I read that somewhere in this topic or that topic TMM9 pointed us to.

The load based routine is just an elegant way of ensuring consistent engine power with varying weather conditions. When it's hot out (less dense air), it'll jack up the turbo a bit. If you have a properly set-up TCV, LDR has no safety benefits, only safety drawbacks imo.

You give up a little power loss in hot conditions for a complete mitigation of boost spikes. If you want both, you'll have to ask Piet or Venderbroeck about supporting ECU software modifications. They're not expensive :)

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ldr off it is then. will need that wb mod tho, but i`m not a fan depending only on wideband sensor itself without having VE fuel table.... in all standalone ecu`s afr table is for correction for perfect fueling, and ve table as baseline, from where ecu should make minor changes for target afr. less % to change, faster the changes apply.  

Boost pressure reduction factor, manual transmission the lower the value, the less tcv duty cycle gonna be applied at 1st gear ? how this works really ?

Configbyte for Gear Dependent Boost Control don`t get it, what value to put for 1st and 2nd MT gear`s to reduce burnouts

also, if i put IAT right before manifold,  i will need to use LDR duty cycle correction, intake air temperature table to build up a map how much tcv duty cycle to remove from main tcv map according to temperaturs, lets say in cold days, when intake air temp is lower, solenoid will work less to maintain same boost pressure, right ? same way on high temp intake temps on hot days i can make turbo to make less pressure not to stress engine so much. i`m thinking right ?

 

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23 hours ago, Boxman said:

Disabling LDR would be the safety reason in itself, imo. Simplest way to avoid boost spikes, which are caused solely by the LDR routine. Afaik you can tweak it such that it only lowers boost and never raises it, think I read that somewhere in this topic or that topic TMM9 pointed us to.

The load based routine is just an elegant way of ensuring consistent engine power with varying weather conditions. When it's hot out (less dense air), it'll jack up the turbo a bit. If you have a properly set-up TCV, LDR has no safety benefits, only safety drawbacks imo.

You give up a little power loss in hot conditions for a complete mitigation of boost spikes. If you want both, you'll have to ask Piet or Venderbroeck about supporting ECU software modifications. They're not expensive :)

This is not an opinio communis though.

You make it sound like the LDR routines are giving big problems with everybody,  experiencing problematic boost overshoot.

Well, that just isn't the case.

I have seeen enough logs  without significant boost overhoot, also with bigger turbo's.

The LDR routines are very well capable of controlling the turbo, even a big turbo.


 

But your have to tune it the right way.

If you're asking for a load higher then the turbo is capable of  delivering during spool up,  the ECU will up the TCV to a 100% in an attempt to meet with the  load requested.

In that case, when  the turbo  finally is able to spool up, pressure will rise very fast, with the wastegate all closed.

It's just not realistic to expect that the LDR routine and mechanically the TCV, wastegate system can respond fast enough to compensate for that. 

 

Looking at the graph you posted before  for instance:

BoostSpike_Spike.thumb.PNG.2a33dd991eba0

 

What is going wrong here is that your load request (pink line) is way too high during spoolup of the turbo.

The ECU is trying to achieve the requested load, but the turbo cannot deliver yet. So the ECU, unaware of this, ups the TCV to 100%.

(It does this in a very short time, btw,  where you can see how fast the ldr routines really are!)

When the turbo eventually is able to spool, it does this fairly quickly as the wastegate is completely closed due to this to high a load request during spooling up.

The right way to avoid this overshoot is to balance the requested load during the spooling of the turbo with what the turbo can deliver, that is ....lowering it in this case!

And not by turning off the LDR routines altogether.

In my opinion that's a totally wrong approach of the problem you are experiencing.

 

 

 

As long as you're not living near the equator with same temperatures all year round, disabling the LDR routines does have it's advantages:

With the LDR routines disabled:

Going WOT at  25 degr celsius is a whole other thing then going WOT at  -5 degr ceslsius.

When you tune for max power in the summer with ignition advange 1 to 2 degr before knock occurs (you do want max power right?) you will get you knock in winter going WOT.

On the other  hand tuning for max power in winter will give considerable loss of power in summer.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Piet
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colder weather = colder intake temps. colder intake temps = you can add more ignition before detonation, right ? just some theory thoughts. Piet, is it possible to make some boost target table using signal from map sensor aka electronic boost gauge 0-5v signal for example ? i really don`t wanna use ldr routines, for me its just to much time consuming tuning, since you basicly said, boxman way to tune with ldr off, record load, and then build load target table, is kinda not right way to tune it. 

 

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The  problem  is that with cold air you need significant less boost to achieve the load requested.

When you have the LDR routines turned off the boost with cold winterair will be as high as the boost necessary to achieve your requested load during the summer.

Ergo during winter your boost and with that your load will be too high for certain RPM’s crossing the point where knock begins. 

The fact that the the intake air is colder won’t (fully) compensate for that.

 

If someone wants make a tune leaving the LDR routines off... well ... I really don’t say that’s a wrong way to tune per se,  it’s just a choice one makes.

 

In fact I find Boxman’s way of tuning: 

“with ldr off, record load, and then build load target table”

not that bad at all ....on the contrary!

But leaving the LDR routines off after that I’am much less enthousiastic about.

 

 

What I oppose against is the conclusion that the LDR routines would’nt be able to control a larger turbo, because that’s simply not true.

They absolutely can, but for that you have to tune your load request the right way.

Which by the way isn’t that complicated at all.

You just have to bring your load request in sync with what the turbo can deliver while spooling up.

 

 

Edited by Piet
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