938 replies to this topic

[Johann]

 Emiel, on 14 January 2010 - 05:33 PM, said:

Awesome JD!

Are there more C30 owners with Duratec engine's?

Yes, many..

But those are 1.8 and 2.0 versions..

[Emiel]

 Johann, on 14 January 2010 - 06:50 PM, said:

Yes, many..

But those are 1.8 and 2.0 versions..

Dreknek...

I meant the 2.3..

[Johann]

Took the car for a spin today! Things appear promising.



engine bay needs a lot of cleaning up but for now it is fully functional.



Plug wire are to long but the only ones I could find on short notice fitting both the engine and MSD coil.

I think I will convert to COP soon.

[T5shortblock]

COP ftw!!

Nice work!! We need sound clips!!!!!

[Johann]

 T5shortblock, on 16 January 2010 - 07:26 PM, said:

Nice work!! We need sound clips!!!!!

Still having some issues in the idle->1500 RPM area because of the e-throttle system. Engine is running without an idle control valve at the moment but the e-throttle system has idle control incorporated. Partially a reason which kept me from installing an idle control valve for now. Second reason, and I have been stupid here, is that the Cosworth manifold has a provisioning for an idle control valve. A very nice one I must add which doesn't use hoses. I wanted to source such a valve later on and use an 850 valve for now if needed. Stupid thing is that I threaded the air hole in the manifold and put a plug in to close the hole but I thought I had used a mild thread sealer which turns out to be much stronger.. Used a brass plug and it appears it won't come out anymore.

The 1.6 engine used a 45 mm throttle body. I installed a 54 mm throttle body as used on the Duratec 2.0 engine but when using this TB as is it won't work on the 1.6 EMS. I could get the 54 mm throttle body to work by exchanging the "pot meter" cover with the one from the 1.6 throttle body. They are similar sized. I guess all this combined throws the idle opening and behavior off. So far the engine has run pretty rough idle at 1000 RPM but after warming up it starts to hunt and after it jumps below 500 RPM the throttle plate will open up to much and stall the engine. I can't get the hunting to stop and it appears the throttle plate is moving constantly. Bleeding air in the manifold showed some different behavior so I want to try to add an idle control valve and steer it open loop. I'm afraid when using closed loop the e-throttle and the idle control valve will start fighting each other. Added to that I need to get a feel for the engine, at the moment I'm swimming..
So far above 2000 RPM up to 4500 RPM the engine responds very well to changes made in the Linkplus G3 ECU and in those RPM's the e-throttle is behaving very well. With the OEM EMS still in place the dash has working tacho, speedo and engine temp but is also lit like a christmas tree because of all the fault codes. Traction control is gone and the SRS system is offline because of the missing interior.

For the mapping part, I have driven the car around the block a couple of times using my oldest son as a laptop stand..
This because there is no passenger seat in the car now. It was fun cruising together and he showed great interest in what was going on. The first meters the car bogged a lot and my son said if this was going to happen all the time he would get out of the car. I told him to have patience and soon the bogging was gone at mild load. After that some accel enrichment needed to be dialed in so I pushed the throttle a bit more after which the bogging came back of course and I heard "oh no not again!" Lucky for him the engine started behaving better and better up to a point where is ran pretty smooth at part throttle between ~2000 and 4500 RPM. Still I have made to little miles to get a good feel for the engine and once the idle issues are solved I can drive the car as DD for a while and get the part load sorted out. Full load will be done on a dyno later on but given the experience with the SDM and the former SD-C project most time will go in making the car drive smooth in every day traffic.

Will post a video by the time the car runs well if that is OK with you?

[lookforjoe]

Do you pay your laptop stand? Sounds like you have your work cut out for you with the idle/part load issue! (and getting that plug back out of the manifold port).

Looking forward to videos!

[Johann]

 lookforjoe, on 16 January 2010 - 10:35 PM, said:

Do you pay your laptop stand?

Well yes.. this type of laptop stand needs to eat..

Quote

Sounds like you have your work cut out for you with the idle/part load issue! (and getting that plug back out of the manifold port).

It has been a hassle so far.. Also attempt two to remove the plug has failed so I think I'm forced to try and drill it out..
Did some experimenting with the idle "leak" to determine how much extra air is needed but the all the leftover holes in the manifold are to small to make it happen. Added to that I also was under the impression that the injectors used didn't play nice. Because they are firing in batch mode the amount of control near idle is little and they are barely capable of reaching the desired power level. I borrowed these injectors to see how they would do with the OEM EMS but now that I have control I decided to exchange them for blue 395 CC injectors again. Also decided to go sequential and like mentioned to add COP coils. For the coils to fit the cam cover a different cam cover was needed because the one which was on the engine was missing the COP bolt holes. I sourced a suitable cam cover at a wreck yard and the COP coils are on order.

While exchanging the cam cover I also got confirmation about the cams. The engine came with hotter cams like promised. They appear to be of a stage 1 type which means largest size possible with stock pistons and valve train.

I hope the coil will be in before the weekend. Need to make a couple of changes to the wiring loom and also add some things and basically need to start from scratch again after that.
The e-throttle remains a point of concern.

Quote

Looking forward to videos!

I'm sorry but you have to wait a bit longer..

[Johann]

The cleaner look,


And I thought winter was over..

[nari]

 Johann, on 26 January 2010 - 07:58 AM, said:

And I thought winter was over..

haha, -15 right now over here I hate winter

[Johann]

Update,

Lot of things have happened but not much progress has been made unfortunately..
Converted the engine to COP direct spark ignition and sequential injection but it never ran properly.
Converted to cable throttle which works OK. Ignition was very unpredictable and it looked like the ECU couldn't get a proper base timing but the software didn't show anything odd or non functional.
One day it ran reasonably well, next day everything was different and the engine ran bad, next day engine didn't run at all..
To make sure it wasn't the engine itself I reverted back to wasted spark/group fire using the MSD coil and the cables again and now it appears the engine runs fine again. Idle still needs some attention but now it keeps running instead of becoming erratic and stall with the electronic throttle body..

Used a 65 mm 850 GLT throttle body from the former red 850 and made a throttle pedal. Very little space for a pedal, difficult to lead the throttle cable through the firewall..









Did some rewiring,



Fuel pump under standalone control now.

Still a lot of cleaning up for the wiring is needed since the whole ignition change has been done rather rough to see if it would work but wires are all over the place. Think I'll stay with this setup for now.

Also changed to Alpha N because this engine shows short tempered MAP behavior.

Compared to the 5 cylinder projects I thought 4 cylinder NA would be easy but it has bitten back hard. A difficult road so far but now for the last couple of days there appears to be some consistency in the whole setup which gives better overview which in it's turn makes the whole process go a lot easier. In part load with a very rough mapping the engine ran pretty smooth up to ~5K RPM.
Acceleration needs some attention. Made a new AFR map based on numbers logged and smoothened the whole map which already showed an improvement. If accel plays nice I want to try the quick tune function tomorrow to automatically set some points in the fuel map to the proper values based on a lambda target map. Already used this function before but to make it work fast enough the fixed fuel map needs to be close to the desired values.

If all plays nice I think it will show if there is some grunt in this engine. Or bettter said, if it performs how it sounds,

[Young Burnsy]

Amazing as always Johann.

Keep up the good work!

[Mattphi]

On the intake setup, would anyone think the use of the rubber coupler, instead of aluminum piping, would decrease performance at all? It's a smaller piece so there wouldn't be too much bending I guess.

[loseR99]

Routing the intake into the fenderwell or lower air dam with some functional fender vents would be nasty.

[Johann]

 Mattphi, on 19 February 2010 - 03:36 AM, said:

On the intake setup, would anyone think the use of the rubber coupler, instead of aluminum piping, would decrease performance at all? It's a smaller piece so there wouldn't be too much bending I guess.

There is plenty of air going in as it is but it isn't the nicest transition.. Currently goes from a 3" capable air filter through a 2.5" adapter to the 65 mm throttle body. This simply because I had the hose available. The adapter is also holding the IAT sensor.



Adding length by use of aluminum piping with a similar diameter would probably show a tad slower throttle response. Currently space behind the bumper is a bit limited because of the wiring loom. Part of the loom holds wires for future expansion/changes and I kept them at full length and put it behind the front bumper for now. There is some room to place a filter in that area.

Still the way it is now IAT isn't an issue.

[Mattphi]

Oh ok, reason I was asking is because I have a 45 degree Silicon coupler from Forge. Wondering if that would work in place on my ribbed plastic tubing attached to a filter.

[randomdude]

that should work fine matt.

[Johann]

Broke the 100 mph barrier today..

[lookforjoe]

That's quite a project. The COP just didn't work out, I take it.

Nice fabrication work on the pedal & throttle adaptors.

Any screen shots of your fuel management software? I'm just curious if it looks anything like the TurboTuner maps.

The engine bay certainly looks quite proper!

 Johann, on 18 February 2010 - 10:37 PM, said:

Update,
Lot of things have happened but not much progress has been made unfortunately..
Converted the engine to COP direct spark ignition and sequential injection but it never ran properly.

Also changed to Alpha N because this engine shows short tempered MAP behavior.
Acceleration needs some attention. Made a new AFR map based on numbers logged and smoothened the whole map which already showed an improvement. If accel plays nice I want to try the quick tune function tomorrow to automatically set some points in the fuel map to the proper values based on a lambda target map. Already used this function before but to make it work fast enough the fixed fuel map needs to be close to the desired values.

If all plays nice I think it will show if there is some grunt in this engine. Or bettter said, if it performs how it sounds,

[Johann]

 lookforjoe, on 20 February 2010 - 01:45 AM, said:

That's quite a project. The COP just didn't work out, I take it.

Probably something to do with the trigger sensor setting but if the software says everything is OK and it won't run it is very difficult to gat a bit of a base line and keep the engine running.
Once it it running it is easier to see where something might go wrong.

Quote

Any screen shots of your fuel management software? I'm just curious if it looks anything like the TurboTuner maps.

These are from the link site,

Software is called PClink.

Overview,


Fuel map,


Numeric runtime values,


3d map representation,


Gauges,


Logging,


And the Quicktune function where the wideband can fill the fuel map based on a AFR target map,

[TFIVEM]

thats awesome! great progress as always