Asinine

Yeah, that's right, don't criticize my nation unless you have any idea what you are talknig about. I will certainly agree that the US unemployment system is more effective at forcing displaced Americans into some form of employment no matter the lavel based on their skills or education. And you are right, US unemployment rates are the lowest of the G8, however, the technical definition of unemployment differes from country to country which can explain some of the difference - but not all of it, and your point is valid. Don't worry, I try to minimize the number of visits I make to the US because honestly, I don't feel safe or welcome when I'm there. I have no intention of ever re-locating there, so no worries, but as a caring human being I do worry about how backwards US domestic policy is with respect to social goods. First of all, your health care system is far from privatized, the US government remains the single largest drug purchaser in the US - hmmm. What about things like high levels of personal debt among middle class Americans. How can a family with an interest only mortgage afford to send their children to university when they can't even make any headway on owning a home. And for what will they go to university these days - not science or engineering or something useful, but something useless like and arts degree (me!!) or some other 'personal interest' degree that's going to cost $100k or more. Here is a legitimate comparison to China or India as showcased in Tom Friedmens book "The World Is Flat". India is turning out something like 200,000 engineers a day, and earning more patents per capita then ever before whereas patents per capita are dropping in the US. The fact that higher education is so expensive, is being mis-used (really, what's a BA in Sociology going to get you?) is leading to the US' innovative edge being comprimised. And also true that no one is swayed by online forums. People are generally too ignorant or short sighted to see the problems. And merely presenting showcasing other peopels problems results in backlash. Illustrate some Canadian problems and I'll petition my MP for change. But you don't know any, and while i showcase many problems that are leading the US into a WORSE (read - already bad) state all I get is backlash, and it seems it only comes from those who don't need assistance. And if you don't need assistance, then no one should. Afterall, your parents and grandparents worked hard to build a foundation for you to prosper in - JUST like a monarchy! One last shock and awe point. Given the international disdain the US has attracted especially since GWB has gotten his hands on your country, and the socioeconomic conditions leading to such civil unrest throughout poor areas of the US, the coutnry is being attacked by domestically and abroad all the while being led by a man who can't go one press conference without "back home in texas". Just remember next time you fill up, you're supporting me! Nothing up here, but nice people, safe streets, oil, and free accesible and effective health care... oh did i mention, surplus budgets!! :D

My concern for the US is only out of an investment standpoint. I don't watch the Canadian business climate like I do the US. US equities and futures and options are easier to get in and out of than any other nation in the entire world, and are the most liquid. So, having an ear to the ground and opinions on the US political economy is necessary if i ever want to make boatloads of money doing what i dream of doing. I don't understand how anyone can stand behind the president and say he's done a good job. From a socioeconomic standpoint, there is no G8 nation worse off than the US. You criticize my health care system but really have no concept of it. In the past 24 hours i've kind of realized how futile it is to debate with you people. It really comes down to a pure ideological difference. You think that if people get screwed over they deserve it, unless of course it's you, then you want a handout - the American way. People in NO wanted handouts not jobs, and for that they deserved to die. People who want health care or education need to work for it, if you want it you can have it. It's the American way, free market capitalism right (aren't patents anti-competitive). My opinion is that the states role in my life should be to provide a last ditch safety net. Which includes universal accessable health care, as it does in EVERY G8 nation except the US. As an outsider looking in, i know the US is domestically and internationall up the river without a paddle. You can sit and watch ignorantly from within and claim that all these social hurdels you create are part of the "american way" but that's just silly. and for the record, i know more about the way the US political economy functions than probably 80% of Americans, but there probably isn't an American on here, or many in your nation that really could contribute a quality response with respect to Canada, so since you don't know.. keep your mouth shut! I have and deserve to have a lot of pride for my nation, so don't stomp all over it with you guesses about how we work, it just reinforces the stereotype that Americans are ignorant!

So, your point remains that it's still the citizens fault that turned out so bad?

I see you're still wrestling with the concept of 'intelligent response'. Please feel free to dispute my views. Do you dispute the FACT that education is increasingly becoming an opportunity only for the rich? Do you dispute the FACT that over 10% of the US population doesn't have any heath insurance and MANY more are under-insured? Do you dispute the FACT that month after month the US trade deficit widens as more and more of the goods that are consumed domestically are produced outside of the US? Do you dispute the findings that the US continues to drop in educational competitivness even at public school levels? Do you dispute the FACT that your government has spent over $200 billion dollars more than the president promised the American people it would spend in the war in Iraq? Do you dispute the FACT that the impetus behind taking military action in Iraq was based on lies? Do you dispute the FACT that the social security program is drastically underfunded in a budgetary climate where the government is 'attempting' to cut the fat not increase spending? Like, maybe this is masked superiority of being a proud Canadian over seemingly ignorantly proud Americans. But the absolute lack of intelligent responses is only fueling that complex! Anyone, Bueler!?

i think that's mostly a case of hind sight being 20/20. Like people stay in FL for hurricanes every year and make it through fine. NO turned into a special case becuase of what happened with the levees, which next to no one forsaw. Maybe it is a ideological difference between 'socialist' canada and the US, and could explain why when it comes to the US political economy I just can't understand the republican point of view. Like I value the fact that in some capacity I'm confident that my nation in some way shape or form always has my back. Be it health care, education, unemployment benefits, military response in 'disaster' situations, etc. However, in the US you guys seem quite content with the "every man for themself" additude. For instance, lets, for a minute pretend i was a poor black new orleans father with two kids and a oh yeah! of a wife. Pretend I'm underemployed, wife doesn't work and kids skip school. Probably not too much of a stretch. My family would be hard pressed to make rent or potentially but probably not a mortgage. So I hear this order to evacuate and I think, if i leave, i loose employment income, i have to pay to transport my whole family, i have to pay to accomodate my whole family, i run the risk of having my home pilaged if i leave, etc. etc. So like many Floridians every year i stay and hope for the best - statistically i probably have a good chance. Hurricanes come, next thing you know, i have to have scuba tanks to get in my front door. Federal emergency response.... none. Government supporters say "you should have left, it's your own fault". That's crap. Anyhow, it's obvious that VS is not a place for intelligent debate, just maintaing the status quo, otherwise my threads wouldn't be combined. I guess it's better just to pacify yourself with the material things than open your eyes to the world around you. sigh. intelligent responses.. anyone, anyone... yeah.. as i suspected!?

speaking of trampled liberties... should have kept the old title..

I don't necessarily think that Hillary would be better or worse than "a man", I don't think you could get much worse than Bush - he truly is a incompetant figure head. Yes, you read that correctly, a monarch empire. A few key families in control of the political destiny enlarging the empire to serve it's own ends. I cite, Iraq (in process), Afghanistan and less so these days, but still - Isreal as countries with incredible ties to the US, or future ties. There are more, of course, and the things too look for are former points of US military deployment and imposed democracy. Yes domestic issues crippled to finance various interests. I look at 3.X% defecits as a proportion of GDP, i look at the $250 billion cost of the war in Iraq. You cite the drug benefit program and think it's great, well you're wrong it's a band-aid for a heath care system suffering from (metaphorically) cancer. I have lost no personal freedoms, but I'm Canadian - well that's not true, now in my city of 250,000 people there are some bars where you get frisked before entering, that's new. You are on the verge of phone taps, a new era of religious political corectness, a era where you may not feel safe among your neighbours, where more and more people are owning hand guns (suspicion on my part). How attainable is a high quality college or university education for the average American citizen. The failure of GWB to address domestic issues and only be a war monger has many less developed nations (i.e. South Korea) looking for the US to step in and solve their problems (North Korea) but this focus on geopolitical stabilization from a country that is hated around the world is leading in large part to the domestic demise of the US. Now instead of just asking more questions, try and put a whole sentence together to illustrate your point!

Awesome.. +1 for the personal anecdote! The idea that the blame rests on the citizens or the mayor is crazy! Practically no one predicted the devastation that would ensue. Sure some published reports years before mentioned the poor state of the Levees (sp?) but the president had other pork to fund and wars to run. The fact is that a evacuation that was necessary has never been expected or planned for in US history, not to mention what asking people to evacuate means - especially the multitudes of people who live below the poverty line - can't afford rent, how can they afford a bus ticket and a super 8 AND rent. Starfish, there have been no such statistics or published government "facts" produced in this thread except maybe by me. And how much creedence do US government 'fact' carry these days anyway? You really are quite daft. Come in here and slam Canada in the most ignorant display I've seen in a long time. Each of your points would deserve it's own thread in defence of my nation to illustrate how truly messed up your stereotypes are, but on their own they are worthless because they are so painfull off the mark. You're a very very dumb person... at least politically, and probably not coincidentally, a staunch republican and Bush supporter. I dare you to have an intelligent debate with me on US domestic policy. I'm quite certain I'd pwn you, and I'm not even American.

Don't bypass the word filter you're as ignorant as Anne Coutler with respect to Canada, and probably dumber with respect to domestic issues. you obviously have no idea what you are talking abut, and for that reason, i'm not even going to waste time rebuting those untruths!

America would be lucky to have our health care system, but that's a totally different debate. Here is why i don't like Hillary. 1) She's a woman 2) Look at the faces of the HoR or Congress Put those two together and you see very clearly that US politics is still an old boys club dominated by white old men. America unlike many other nations is still far too ignorant to elect a woman as president even though i fully believe she would do a much better job than Bush - which unfortunatly isn't saying much. I also really don't like the way the political landscape is moving in the US. Not sure where I heard or read this, but an interesting point on how the US is moving more and more to a Monarch Empire than a democratic republic. For instance, lets pretend Clinton's got an outside chance of being prez. come 2008 in reverse order of past presidents: Clintion Bush Clinton Bush Not to mention the political power the Kennedy's have held for so long, and not to mention Jeb Bush as a future Republican presidential candidate. Hillary is great I think, but running her as the democratic presidential candidate I think will ensure another 4 year reign of the inept republican party. Although, I think she would do an excellent job of focusing her politics on domestic issues which have been crippled to finance various interests of "President" George W. Bush. It really is amazing how America is un-developing itself, at least if you are under the impression that personal freedoms have anything to do with development!

I think that's a really poor explanation! Bill Clinton did not balloon the markets, and cudos to Greenspan for seeing the overbought market and calling it. Also, cudos to Clinton for acknowleding the power behind OPEC, too bad exploiting that has lead to $60/bbl oil, but that's not his fault, OPEC would have figured it out soon enough, as the oligopoly model developed as did the Chinese and Indian economies - partially under the open markets mantra Clintion actually believed in, not just claimed as GWB does. I demand accountability, and if you want to blame the political ills of the US of today on Clinton, that's just crazy. I do think Nagin should be held responsible for his part, but GWB sits at the top of that convoluded beuracracy and has the power and the information to make executive decisions to mobilize national organizations, funds and military assets to save lives, he failed to do so. The city of New Orleans' budget and capital could not have made a significant impact on the situation. National assets without a doubt could have, failure to employ them needs to be accounted for! Just because poor black liberal sinners or whatever died does not make it ok, or maybe it does, and it finally proves how embedded racism still remains in the US as a part of its own domestic policy - i'm also thinking of illegal immigrant issues regarding Mexicans doing work 'no American should have to do or would do'. I'm going to assume that by not even mentioning the war in Iraq you acknowledge that it is and continues to be a total blunder of intelligence and action. All of which occured on one or both of the George Bush's watches. The war in Iraq that has cost over 2,000 American lives and altered by injuray over 20 or 30,000 was a political choice, not a political or strategic necessity. I don't follow US congressional events with enough depth to rhyme off the recent resignations and accusations of high powered US political figures but those exist in 2005 and 2006, not in 2001. These are not Clinton's problems, GWB is ruining the USA, and any attempts to skirt the blame to past presidents or really any other cause are futile. As for GWB's first presidential election - his appointment came down to the decision of the supreme court and no one else. He lost the popular vote, and by all accounts lost the vote in Florida. If you want to play legal loop hole game with his appointment to the office of the President then you can't dismiss it and blame accounting loophole-ing that occured with Tyco, Worldcom, Enron, etc. as Bill Clintons fault. Weak argument, Bush is bad for the globe, and especially bad for Americans!

and it should be the only necessary one!

It's not a matter of taking action against crooked politicians, it's a matter of getting the crooked politicans to make some good policy decisions. And Razor, i don't think it would be tough to prove that more and more Americans are becoming Wal-Mart shoppers than are escaping Wal-Mart consumerism. Check same-store sales comps, although they wouldn't be obligated to release this data, i'm sure they track the number of customers in some form or another.

The fact that the US federal government isn't resolute on fixing issues such as education, health care and social security is still not enough. Those are much bigger priorities to the American people than the 1/2 trillion dollar effort in Iraq. As for china and indias growth rates. True the rates aren't comparable, but let me tell you if i had anything to sell or make right now I'd want to be doing so in China. They have a population that is mobilizing to and past the wal-mart style consumer, while domestically more and more noth americans are being forced into wal-marts. North Americans (moreso Americans than Canadians, but we're still behind the 8 ball) have lost the competitive edge, and wasting money the way the Bush administration does isn't helping to rectify that problem.

Truth! I'll agree emphasis on dumb and oh yeah!, but the 'conservative' Republican haven't been too conservative with anything except brokeback bashing and moving toward making pregnancy a political decision not a womans decision.

Is having a president who understands the military the most important criteria for electing a new leader?

I'm not that stupid to be against handguns, but if you think i'm stupid for being against casual ownership of handguns, then i think you're stupid for carrying one 90% of the time. Razor, at least from your last post i have to assume you're more politically enfranchised than most Americans, even most 'educated' Americans. But things are not all good. Here's a few things that are of SERIOUS concern: 1) Oil - currently the US is a huge consumer of oil, most of which comes from Canada or the Middle east. China and India are becomming huge consumers of oil, with greater economic growth prospects. If I was OPEC I'd be looking at solidifying supply contracts with China and India and worrying less about America - in part cause OPEC is mostly mid. easter nations that hate America. 2) Health Care - The single greatest cost for manufacturing a vehicle in the US is health care related costs. The Pharmacuetical lobby in the US is so strong that the US government has been rendered incapable of passing price controls on drugs, or getting anywhere close to a universal system as it exists throughout the developed world. In fact American health care economics continue to get worse as more and more Americans fall into the target market for Wal-Mart where they are looking to save $0.60 on underwear, god forbid having to buy brand name drugs. 3) The economy - The American economy is not all that great. You're looking at 3% GDP growth in 2006 vs. 7 - 9% in China and India. You are setting new trade deficit records every month as more and more of the consumable goods come from abroad. 4) Education - not that America has been near the top in at least a decade, but you continue to slip further down the rankings. More and more high level scholarships from Ivy schools are going to Chinese and Indian kids who want to learn the science and math that will drive innovation, and then upon graduation can't get jobs in the US because Homeland Security makes it almost impossible to get a Green Card. 5) Social Security - It's toast. The numbers of 50 year old without and retirement savings in the US are staggering. The failure of that system will result in an old age poverty pandemic, and extreme resentment toward older people. There's the short list of ideas bouncing around in my head - and i didn't even mention the wasteful wars that are waging So, what does America have going for it right now? 1) Lazy disenfranchised work force. I love when commentators talk about how all these Mexicans do jobs 'no American would do'. That makes me laugh, because soon, primary service jobs are going to make up a significantly larger part of the labour market as the once good blue collar jobs go away through outsourcing or productivity gains. 2) The 30-year bond. This will probably prove to be the 'saviour' of forseeable funding issues - MORE DEBT, which ironically will be owned mostly by.. the Chinese Central Bank, the BOJ, etc. That's about it. It's great that the US still holds on to the real innovation centres (google campus, microsoft HQ, Texas Instruments, etc., etc.) but high tech, highly innovative companies are finding a lot more passion for innovation on the other side of the world than they can find domestically. My inital point here was that GWB is a nice guy, and is as responsible for a number of sensless deaths as Ken Lay is for financially devastating a few thousand people. Death is worse than lost money last time i checked, and i think the punishment should fit the crime, but am continually angered by the absolute lack of punishment. My point now is that the US just rides on what we have or what we had, and is blind to the massive changes that are occuring in the global economy. I have purposly thrown in a lot of "we" or "our" because Canada is plauged with a lot of the same social opinions of "best place to live", and while I'd agree that Canada is still the best place to live in the world, I don't think i could objectivly hold on to that opinion in say 10 years becasue there are 2.5 billion people that want to live as well as we do, even if it means we don't get to live as well as we do! Wow.. i'm definitly over capacity on ranting today!

Razor, i love the post, but i really think your government is running all over the globe pointing fingers at individuals - bin Laden, Kimmy from Korea, Saddam. Even domesticly with the CEOs that are being indicted. If US organizations are so hung up on pin pointing accountability on individuals I don't understand how no one inside the government is getting a finger pointed at them! To be honest, all the US governments priorities are wack. Concentration on war, not affordable health care or emergency response. The US continues to slip from their acceptable level in academic competitions, could illiteracy be on the rise? Millions of dollars are being spent prosecuting white collar crime while hand gun ownership proliferates in inner cities (I'm Canadian, I'm morally opposed to citizens having hand guns). With the help of unions and legacy manufacturing the US work force has become globally uncompetitive, and with tuitions on the rise, there are fewer and fewer formally educated people leaving US schools to drive new innovation. --- Anyhow, Javadoc, I didn't get pwned at all. Really, if I have no right being concerned about US politics, then i should make a "PWNED" picture with some planes flying into a couple buildings. But I am concerned, and worried, and really, not enough Americans are as politically realistic as you have to be, becasue you have to protect yourself, your government is too busy protecting itself!

This isn't a USA vs. USA or USA vs. Iraq thing. The world is very interconnected, and the US' poor political (domestic and foreign) decisions are effecting all of us. Frankly, if i was looking out for Canada's best interest in the short sighted manner US politicians look at theirs, i should be happy. Look at our stock market, look at our dollar, look at the money we are making selling oil to the USA - not sure if you know this, but the #1 oil import nation of the US is.. Canada. Now, I hate to use examples from decades ago to prove my point but is this the excuse your nation used to keep itself out of Europe in WW2? -> "We're not British, the Nazi's aren't our problem" Cause the bottom line is the mistakes of your government are making this whole globe a significantly more dangerous place to live, which makes that little red necks decisions very important to me! As if you'd be upset, I'd like to see affordable health care for you, or a national pension plan that might actually work - kind of like the rest of the developed world has, but if you'd rather I stop being upset on your account.. well, i just can't do that!

So, I'm sure we all remember that Enron defrauded so many financial statements and created so many off-shore legal entities that it drove itself into bankruptcy, and in doing so financially devastated thousands of employees and share holders. Both the CEO and i believe CFO are still being prosecuted. Similar story applies for Worldcom which practiced some nifty accounting and hid billions of dollars in losses. The former CEO Bernie Ebbers has been sentenced to jail time as a result. The list of accounting offenders goes on and on. Tyco execs, Conrad Black, Martha Stewart, etc. all facing difficult trials and many facing or have already served jail time. So, what's the point? Well, today or yesterday the US government released it's account of the national response to hurricane Katrina. That Katrina oh yeah! killed a bunch of people, reduced a great number of people to anarchy, turned a great city into a pond with roofs like lillypads, etc. etc. Also, I heard from John Stewart or Stephen Colbert that the US government is re-classifying previously declassified documents. Moreover, if you watch any interview with an US politicians these days it's the conversationalists equivalent to riding a stationary bike because they won't answer anything. So, my question is - when is George W. Bush going to jail? The US people are paying hundreds of thousands of dollars to investigate Enron which bankrupted a bunch of people, but no one is being prosecuted for the gross mis-managment of Katrina. What about casualties of a war based on Colin Powells 'intelligence'. What prosecution is being carried out against people who colluded to take a nation to war based on lies, then see thousands of young Americans injured or killed as a result of that collusion. Is it becoming clear to anyone else that the US government is attaining Nazi-esque control over the US. GWB was elected by the supreme court, not the American people. On his watch terrorists have struck his nation, he is surrounded by secrecy, his second in command can shoot someone and not have it reported for hours, he's setting new records for fiscal mismanagment to fund a war, his government failed to react to impending domestic threats such as Hurricane Katrina. And within the past 72 hours his office has approved the sale of many US ports to the UAE, a country which has had a spotty record at best for harbouring terrorists. Moreover, up until the past few weeks or maybe now months, GWB never advised Americans to conserve energy or oil, and never supported the Kyoto accord. Now he is pleading with Americans to reduce their dependence on oil. He said in his sate of the union speech that America is ADDICTED to oil - that's quite a significant change in policy. My concern here, is that for the past 6 years the President has generally done a pretty good job running his office wihout letting the American people have one iota of an idea of what's really going on. His cronies make policy decisions and go forth, creating facts as they see fit and informing only when absolutly necessary. This scares me as a Canadian as a neighbour, and also becasue Steven Harper is as much of a nice guy as GWB and his policy with respect to the media is very much the same - which is, say nothing, be accountable for nothing. Accountability eh. Ken Lay (former Enron CEO) should be held accountable for his mistakes in oversight. He claims he didn't know exactly what was going on, and in doing so he's a lot like the President who continually tries to dodge accountability bullets. George W. Bush should be held accountable for his mistakes in oversight, which include but are not limited to all casualties of the war in Iraq (if you don't know by now, that was a HUGE mistake), and the casualties in New Orleans. The US government is jerk BACKWARDS. If the republicans have as much political power in 2008 I'm moving, becasue Canada is either going to be taken over for our oil, or destroyed by the catastropic path that 'good ol boy' administration believes in. In closing, this rant comes one day after Canada lost to Russia in the Olympics. Canada brought a team of old players who were used to commercial breaks, and extended intermissions. Many Canadian players admitted afterward that putting on a Team Canada jersey doesn't mean the same to them as putting on a Russian jersey does for the Russians - or pretty much any european team. We assembled a bunch of Canadian super stars expecting a cake walk. My point here is that this is serious business, if you're in it for the prestige or resume building you're in it for the wrong reason. Our hockey players need to LOVE Canada to win, and the US politicians need to LOVE America to accomplish anything real. Hockey used to be Canada's game, as geopolitical dominance used to be Americas! The New Orleans area is being re-built with mobile homes as 'temporary housing'. That area has been devastated and is being rebuilt as a trailer park, while real expensive rebuilding goes on in Iraq, or are they even at rebuilting yet. Again, CEOs are punished for breaking accounting laws, but the President of the USA is unscathed for wasting life on account of his administrations stupidity. Not to mention engineering future crisis' such as Social Security, health care, education, etc. Demand Accountability!!!

Can i have my posts back?

please let me sleep now... argh....

Man, i thought i earned my VS e-mail today, but i'm only half way there - 5hitterz!

yo man, you can't give me stuff for spelling or even grammar in this thread.. those are the rulez!

man that's "weak sauce". got an idea, needed to get the wheels turning and i'm back! I'm going to start my own religion and this is going to be my new years - and like jan 25 will be my Present Day so all my fellow religious people will get to do our Present shopping during boxing week! Unless you're stupid at chirstmas shopping and still leave things last minute.. then you totally blow at life! yeppers!?..