ErikS Posted August 30, 2012 Report Share Posted August 30, 2012 I'm not writing a paper for my poli-sci class, so citations are not necessary. I've read most of Diamond's books. The data is one sentence away in a search engine however. Last I checked Egypt has the most religious society in Africa and the world. It seems not to be helping the government maintain a moral standard very well, amirite? The next nine on the list are just as scary. Turn to more non-religious nations, much more stable in both "morality" and economics. I want my government to put people ahead of faith. They are not mutually exclusive. The US in not monistic in terms of ethnicity or culture, which is why it is even more important to have leaders not influenced by their faith, just the facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyfishing3 Posted August 31, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 31, 2012 I want my government to put people ahead of faith. They are not mutually exclusive. The US in not monistic in terms of ethnicity or culture, which is why it is even more important to have leaders not influenced by their faith, just the facts. Precisely why PR comment last night------""our rights come from nature and god, not from the govt"" gave me chills last night The govt has no place/position/roll in determining/dictating women reproductive rights period Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilled man Posted August 31, 2012 Report Share Posted August 31, 2012 Put it this way if a JW ( .7% of the US population )was to ever run for president I guarantee you I will be the one to hand him his death before he could ever hand out his cult views to anyone else . And I really don't want a cult that only speaks for 1.7% of the US population running it either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7 VII 7 Posted August 31, 2012 Report Share Posted August 31, 2012 http://www.rollingst...apital-20120829 The guy is scum all around , and dont worry rape babies abort themselves Instead of building new companies from the ground up, we took out massive bank loans and used them to acquire existing firms, liquidating every asset in sight and leaving the target companies holding the note. Cuttyshark boyies ! - Goodfellas - I thought I was being original with this idea LOL ..... I am not damn Reading the article... It says "Or it can go bankrupt – this happens after about seven percent of all private equity buyouts".. thats it? only 7%? That 7% could be rolled into the fact that the bought out company shit the bed on production, service and that companies management. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilled man Posted August 31, 2012 Report Share Posted August 31, 2012 Dave I am seriously surprised you would vote for some who is in a cult . Also http://gawker.com/5939260/mitt-romney-looted-a-dying-company-for-executive-bonuses-while-it-owed-taxpayers-millions Not only that it seems these cult followers like to lie left and right it's been counted of over 553 lies in 30 weeks from Rommel And this his mindless twat side kick http://factcheck.org/2012/08/ryans-vp-spin/ I don't have a side at all but I can plainly see what side is evil, granted I am bias against old white dudes who follow cults and pressure others to follow there plainly wrong and fucked up views . That can be proven a lie with a little googling. Grant the cognitive dissence is strong in this thread . -Alan sorry if this offends you and is not pointed at you what so ever , and if more were like you I wouldn't have my grudge against them all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burn-E Posted August 31, 2012 Report Share Posted August 31, 2012 Egypt has suffered from oppression at the hands of colonial and native dictators and most likely so have the other 9 you're talking about Erik. So it's not the religion at play here but instead factions leveraging religion as an influence to motivate action by the people through manipulation. I'd be interested to know what study you're citing and how they determined their ranking of religiosity at the national level. I'm not writing a paper for my poli-sci class, so citations are not necessary. I've read most of Diamond's books. The data is one sentence away in a search engine however. Last I checked Egypt has the most religious society in Africa and the world. It seems not to be helping the government maintain a moral standard very well, amirite? The next nine on the list are just as scary. Turn to more non-religious nations, much more stable in both "morality" and economics. I want my government to put people ahead of faith. They are not mutually exclusive. The US in not monistic in terms of ethnicity or culture, which is why it is even more important to have leaders not influenced by their faith, just the facts. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burn-E Posted August 31, 2012 Report Share Posted August 31, 2012 And Justin I'm not offended because I know you and your history with religion. What I'm saying is that it's easy throw around the word cult when you don't know the people. The reality is there are far more in my personal faith like me than what people perceive of Mitt Romney. He doesn't represent Mormons he's merely one of us. :shrug: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCviggen Posted August 31, 2012 Report Share Posted August 31, 2012 (edited) He doesn't represent Mormons he's merely one of us. :shrug: On the other hand, it would be nice if you could trust someone running for president to make reasonable decisions based on available evidence. Considering to be a mormon you have to believe that Jesus visited America, the story coming from a known con-man who found gold plates that nobody else ever saw (and which were "lost" afterwards)............ magic underwear...... ........... . ...... That people like this can run for high offices is frankly scary and unworthy of a currently advanced country. That's not to say Obama's "faith" is necessarily better, not at all. I'm with Penn Jilette on this one (unfortunately, he's quite insufferable) Edited August 31, 2012 by JCviggen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burn-E Posted August 31, 2012 Report Share Posted August 31, 2012 JC I don't know you but do you use the same disparaging tone when speaking to Jews, other Christians or Sikhs concerning the origins of their faith and the symbols of their covenants? I'm sure you're only perpetuating what you've heard others say but the Mormon garments are no different from the Jewish Tallit (their cloth with fringes they wear) or the Sikh turban and the other 4 emblems they carry on their body. They are physical reminders of promises made to God. I personally wear them. There's nothing secretive about them but I would appreciate a little more respect when discussing this topic. There's nothing more unusual in believing Joseph Smith's experiences in receiving a visit from God the Father and Jesus Christ and the command to translate the Book of Mormon than to believe Moses separated the Red Sea, that Jesus turned water to wine, or that Mohammed received a visit from the angel Gabriel. These are faith based beliefs and it is poor form to disparage another man's beliefs just because you don't believe them. Every single President who has served this country was/is a Christian on some level. Mitt Romney would be no different. Except perhaps that he, like I spent years of his life in volunteer service as a pastor to a local congregation of people. 20 to 40 hours a week caring for the poor helping them find jobs, providing counsel to the distressed and depressed, caring for the elderly by tending to their homes and bringing meals. I lived in his congregation in Boston well after his service as pastor was over ( it generally lasts for 5-7 years). He served for 15 years. So unless you know the man personally and understand the level of service he provided to hundreds of people (all for free by the way - there is no paid clergy in our church it's all volunteer) you don't know what you're talking about. Instead you're perpetuating unfounded stories . And by the way there are written testimonies from 15 other men who all saw the golden plates Joseph translated. Plus the testimonies of many others who saw them as well. Do your research please before you perpetuate more lies about Mormons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilled man Posted August 31, 2012 Report Share Posted August 31, 2012 Wait the south park episode isnt all that I need to know about mormons ? Crap ! - I personally dont care what relgion he is ( as long as he keeps his religious belifes sepereate from work ) , I am more concerned about past work history and all the crap that he pukes out that is flat out untrue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fudge_Brownie Posted August 31, 2012 Report Share Posted August 31, 2012 I'm sorry but these statements rack up as essentially saying: "Don't legislate morality." Which is utter bullshit because laws = morality. The principles taught by any of the major religions when it comes to moral behavior are what is needed to help build proper citizens. Note I never said it was the ONLY solution, in fact I threw in atheism to comfort those who would declare that religion is unnecessary. Whether you're religious or not I don't really care. But if you're going to ask to govern then we should care about the moral compass of the individual. That's what I'm saying. Disagree; I'm not saying don't legislate morality. Though full disclosure, I'm sure you already know that I'm in favor of bare minimum legislation with regards to personal freedom. I'm saying that when you propose a law, or dispute a law, it should be based on some form of rational argument. It would not include ANY, 100% ZERO reference to a religious teaching. I imagine it would include things like poling of "the people" (what an idea!), any kind of research and data gathered, maybe statements of experts in that topic, and the debate would be centered around this. At no point would it be acceptable to inject any kind of argument related to any religion, given freedom of religion, as well as the rapidly diversifying population. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilled man Posted August 31, 2012 Report Share Posted August 31, 2012 To the simple fact , a persons body is there own and what ever they decide to do themselves wether its good for them or not is not up to the Goverment to decide and espically not some religious fanatic either. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burn-E Posted August 31, 2012 Report Share Posted August 31, 2012 That's fine Justin until you turn around and ask the government to fund your right to do certain things to your body using the taxes of those who disagree with those actions. It's not quite so simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErikS Posted August 31, 2012 Report Share Posted August 31, 2012 That's fine Justin until you turn around and ask the government to fund your right to do certain things to your body using the taxes of those who disagree with those actions. It's not quite so simple. Is Justin on birth control? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyfishing3 Posted August 31, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 31, 2012 how does taking away the right to a female medical procedure affect your taxes? i know different people that have had them, they just paid the bill, it wasn't paid for by any govt AGENCY. They weren't on GOVT assistance, no FOOD stamps etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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