Some Sub/amp Install Ideas.

[JVC]

My sister was talking to me the other day and wants me to put a sub in her car while she's home in a few weeks (2005 Ford Escape, yeah i know i know not volvo but whatever). Heres the dilemma. She wants it to be easily removeable, and to us that means undo the two wires at the amp and boom the box is out, to her, that means i have to make it easier for her.

Heres what I was thinking, mount the amp on the side so its out of the way enough so that doesn't have to be removed. then wire in everything up to the amp hidden enough it wont get in the way of the rear seats folding down or anything. Then in between the sub and the amp put in some kinda connector so that there is just one plug to undo and re-do and while the sub isnt in, there should be no worries about having the two speaker wires going to the sub getting power but not going anywhere, because if i used a standard wiring cup thing on the back of the box, when the wires are undone there is still a live end that the current can go to which would be bad incase they shorted together.

So i went back to my RC car history and figured I could use something like a deans connector (if you know what is is congrats if not, its one of the more preffered wire connectors among RC cars). Or maybe another type of audio connector that I haven't really researched yet.

Up to that point I think everything should work, please make comments if theres something that wont work.

I have an older Dual brand 300w Amp that whould work to power one 10-12" sub (which I haven't found yet, and am hoping to find a relatively cheap decent sub since she just wants more boom, nothing like Type R necessities)

I have MDF to make a box that I can easily do and build to the correct size of the sub and style that my sister wants (probably just a cube), and I have extra wire from my system that I should be able to use, including a fuse.

SPARK NOTES

-My sister wants a sub in her Ford Shitscape, and has "hired" me to do it for as cheap as possible.

-I'm thinking I can put a connector in the speaker wire going to the subs to make the box easy to take out without leaving live speaker wires sitting in the trunk.

-I need some suggestions on a cheaper but good 10-12" sub (under $70 preferrably)

Hope to get some help, otherwise I might have to go to a Ford Forum (o hellz naw)

-John

[Chilled man]

Mount amp under seat or someplace that it cant be seen.

then just have the speaker wires with quick connects to the sub.

simple and easy

or just get some of these and dont worry about doing anything else.

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-ml6Xhs126qp/A...px?I=108BASSLIN

simple and easy

[JVC]

quick connects? like a terminal cup?

I have most everything that she needs but a sub, and she wants it cheap. that would be a good alternativeapart from the cost... so thats why i am using stuff i already have sitting around, ya know?

so i really just need to find a cheap good subto use that is like 150w rms and 300 peak, then it will be exactly to what the amp can produce bridged at 4 ohms.

-John

[Young Burnsy]

Does she listen to rock or rap.

That will allow you to make the decision to go either 10" or 12".

rock = 10"

rap = 12"

I suggest getting either an infinity or a rockford fostgate.

Solid subs. I have had four infinity's and they are super clean.

Tho, i blew all 4... haha

i dont think that will be an issue for you.

[ChasB]

Does she listen to rock or rap.

That will allow you to make the decision to go either 10" or 12".

rock = 10"

rap = 12"

How does this have any correlation? You have any scientific facts to back this up?

I would personally go with this Dayton quattro, or a pair of Tangband 6.5s wired in series to 8 ohms.

[Young Burnsy]

I am not sure how much you know about car audio. But from my experience and what I have researched online over the past few years I have been involved in car audio. I have found that the smaller subs can usually hit higher notes better and have better response compared to larger speakers. Since the speaker is smaller it moves less air so the the voice coil response is faster, which gives a punchier sound. The larger the speaker gets, the more air it moves making it harder for it to hit the quick and high notes, but making it much more effective at hitting the longer and lower notes.

For example I have two 12" Infinity's subs and my good friend has a 15" Kicker L7 which is a square sub. The surface area of one of the Infinity's is smaller than the L7 there for pushing less air and making the response time faster than the L7. Allowing my subs to hit the higher notes better than my friends. That why I suggested the 10s for rock and the 12s for rap. I don't know anything about the brands of speakers you are looking at. I hope this helps. :tup:

[Jippi 855 GLT]

for cheap go with a self powered basslink or bazooka. i found a basslink for 150 on craigslist picked it up, installed it and it hits pretty good. since she has an suv it might be a good way to go, they dont take up much room for the times u need cargo space. craigslist is a good place for cheap stuff... the while thing with a new amp kit cost me 210.

[ChasB]

I am not sure how much you know about car audio. But from my experience and what I have researched online over the past few years I have been involved in car audio. I have found that the smaller subs can usually hit higher notes better and have better response compared to larger speakers. Since the speaker is smaller it moves less air so the the voice coil response is faster, which gives a punchier sound. The larger the speaker gets, the more air it moves making it harder for it to hit the quick and high notes, but making it much more effective at hitting the longer and lower notes.

For example I have two 12" Infinity's subs and my good friend has a 15" Kicker L7 which is a square sub. The surface area of one of the Infinity's is smaller than the L7 there for pushing less air and making the response time faster than the L7. Allowing my subs to hit the higher notes better than my friends. That why I suggested the 10s for rock and the 12s for rap. I don't know anything about the brands of speakers you are looking at. I hope this helps.

There are too many variables to substantiate your claim.

First, you haven't heard every single woofer in existence (on the same amp), so judging tonality compared to others is impossible.

Secondly, xmax (excursion), SD (cone area), mms (cone mass), and voice coil diameter have little to do with how "punchy" a woofer is, this can be more attributed to your amplifier and enclosure design which color your sound more so than the speaker.

Thirdly, you speak of a response time. Do you happen to know how fast electricity moves? Fast enough to make that tiny bit of displacement difference between cone diameters negligible.

Fourthly, why are you using a subwoofer for frequencies above 60, or even 80 HZ, that's what a midbass or midrange driver is for, anything above 60 hz from my woofer sounds like total crap.

Fifthly, you listened to each setup in different environments with totally different acoustical properties, which affects how the woofer responds in that environment, and ultimately how it sounds.

Sixthly, I think "mainstream" brand speakers are a rip off, even if you don't buy them at MSRP. They are often made in china where they have very low quality control standards and very loose tolerances. Support the American made "internet" brand speakers (Acoustic Elegance, DD, Fi, Ascendant Audio, Dayton just to name a few), they may be a few bucks more (often cheaper than the equivalent mainstream counterparts), but they are worth it.

My point being, the entire installation is more important than the equipment you choose. With a good install, your setup can sound like you dropped 10 grand on it. Where as if you drop 10 grand on a stereo and don't install it right, it might not even sound better than stock. Nothing personal, but I'm tired of reading things like this whenever I decide to venture out of my audio forums, maybe I should venture out less often.

If that amp you are using is a 2 channel, maybe consider getting a pair of good components and some enclosures for the kicks, it would sound a lot better than having everything overpowered by bass.

[/rant]

[lnlogauge]

For example I have two 12" Infinity's subs and my good friend has a 15" Kicker L7 which is a square sub. The surface area of one of the Infinity's is smaller than the L7 there for pushing less air and making the response time faster than the L7. Allowing my subs to hit the higher notes better than my friends. That why I suggested the 10s for rock and the 12s for rap. I don't know anything about the brands of speakers you are looking at. I hope this helps.

Size may make a minimal difference, but when the box setup is controlled to the specific sound, and quality components are used. More surface area can be compensated with the correct power. The difference you hear with your freinds is a l7 solo baric, which is made to sound loud, and sound like crap. They have no response time, because thats not what the goal of the square sub is..

For the Original post, I have had tremendous success buying used equipment. Check craigslist, as long as you dont mind the whole driving around with stolen equipment thing

One of these days I'm going to do the research on some car audio forums to prove my low opinion of the Type R sub. I can only imagine the amount of flack i'll receive from this forum.

[Young Burnsy]

There are too many variables to substantiate your claim.

First, you haven't heard every single woofer in existence (on the same amp), so judging tonality compared to others is impossible.

Secondly, xmax (excursion), SD (cone area), mms (cone mass), and voice coil diameter have little to do with how "punchy" a woofer is, this can be more attributed to your amplifier and enclosure design which color your sound more so than the speaker.

Thirdly, you speak of a response time. Do you happen to know how fast electricity moves? Fast enough to make that tiny bit of displacement difference between cone diameters negligible.

Fourthly, why are you using a subwoofer for frequencies above 60, or even 80 HZ, that's what a midbass or midrange driver is for, anything above 60 hz from my woofer sounds like total crap.

Fifthly, you listened to each setup in different environments with totally different acoustical properties, which affects how the woofer responds in that environment, and ultimately how it sounds.

Sixthly, I think "mainstream" brand speakers are a rip off, even if you don't buy them at MSRP. They are often made in china where they have very low quality control standards and very loose tolerances. Support the American made "internet" brand speakers (Acoustic Elegance, DD, Fi, Ascendant Audio, Dayton just to name a few), they may be a few bucks more (often cheaper than the equivalent mainstream counterparts), but they are worth it.

My point being, the entire installation is more important than the equipment you choose. With a good install, your setup can sound like you dropped 10 grand on it. Where as if you drop 10 grand on a stereo and don't install it right, it might not even sound better than stock. Nothing personal, but I'm tired of reading things like this whenever I decide to venture out of my audio forums, maybe I should venture out less often.

If that amp you are using is a 2 channel, maybe consider getting a pair of good components and some enclosures for the kicks, it would sound a lot better than having everything overpowered by bass.

[/rant]

Whoa dude,

Take it easy.

I was just trying to help out. I didn't claim to know everything. I just thought I would offer what I knew and I thought was correct information. It doesn't seem to me that top quality is the priority here and I be easy to understand.

Just trying to help. That's what I thought this forum was for. I am not trying to start a fight in this thread which is clearly here for a different purpose.

You sound like you know a lot about car audio, and I could stand to learn a lot from you. I would be grateful if you were willing to share some of your knowledge with me sans the know-it-all. As I am in the market for a new system and prefer SQ over SPL.

I don't think it's fair that you can assume that most people on this forum to know as much as you might about audio seeing the general topic base has little to do with such.

[JVC]

I'm gonna go ahead and pretened I read all of that, she listens to a lot of rap/hiphop/pop etc. I'll probably use a Rockford Fosgate Punch woofer, 12" because its max specs are exactly what the amp produces so its gonna be perfectly mated. I think it should work just fine and from what I heard from a friend with a Punch it ain't too bad.

Truth be told, she just wants more power and to look like a baller with a sub in her car, haha.

-John

[Grocery_Getter_96]

Bazooka Tube Maybe?

[Che'_Moderator]

How does this have any correlation? You have any scientific facts to back this up?

I would personally go with this Dayton quattro, or a pair of Tangband 6.5s wired in series to 8 ohms.

Hes on crack.

[UnknownSoldier]

Hes on crack.

ROFL, hey ChasB, what i think youngburnsy was trying to say was that the 15" hits the lower frequencies better and goes lower than the 12"s do, and that though the bass is less on his 12"s , its more controlled bass and doesn't drag as much and can go a little higher frequencywise than the 15"er, thats the way i took it. But you have a very valid point also and sound like you know what you are talking about,i have installed a few systems myself, have done quite a bit of research and am an electrical technician by trade and have used 2x10", 2x12", and even 1x 15" and 2x 15" in my own car, the best overall for all systems, sound,quality,& listenability, the winners definitely were the 2 x12"s, but it also depends on the drivers that you use and the amplification, no use having bad amps on good speakers or the other way around, whatever you do, go with a known brand and within your budget and the results should speak for themselves.

John, u know by now what the fk ur doing with ur installations, mods n shit so.....sit back, plan it all out, and take sum pics, how was Canada BTW?????

[Che'_Moderator]

ROFL, hey ChasB, what i think youngburnsy was trying to say was that the 15" hits the lower frequencies better and goes lower than the 12"s do, and that though the bass is less on his 12"s , its more controlled bass and doesn't drag as much and can go a little higher frequencywise than the 15"er, thats the way i took it. But you have a very valid point also and sound like you know what you are talking about,i have installed a few systems myself, have done quite a bit of research and am an electrical technician by trade and have used 2x10", 2x12", and even 1x 15" and 2x 15" in my own car, the best overall for all systems, sound,quality,& listenability, the winners definitely were the 2 x12"s, but it also depends on the drivers that you use and the amplification, no use having bad amps on good speakers or the other way around, whatever you do, go with a known brand and within your budget and the results should speak for themselves.

John, u know by now what the fk ur doing with ur installations, mods n shit so.....sit back, plan it all out, and take sum pics, how was Canada BTW?????

Your getting into THD and sensitivity. If you have a speaker with lets say 130db sensitivity at 1 hz, with a THD of .0000000000000000001% its going to sound good if its a 6" speaker and its going to sound good if its a 20" speaker. But its mostly moot. Half your boofers listen to ipods. And heres a hint. Ipods do not have range much below 30hz forget 15. Even my DVDAs are not that great compared to LP. But saying a 10" speaker is better for rock than a 12" speaker is like saying yellow is faster than red.