wheelsup Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 OK so this is driving me nuts. About 6 months ago my lower radiator hose blew going around 35 mph and the car overheated. Fixed that, filled with coolant by my indy. 1 month later it overheated when my fan relay failed and I drove around with no fan on with the a/c operating. This happened slowly at around 10 mph around 200 feet from my garage, so I drove back and parked it.I replaced the water pump, t-stat, ECT, and hoses around 1 month after that.It has now been another 2 months. Car has lost around 1 cm worth of coolant as measured on the coolant tank when cold in the past 1500 miles or so. So slowly that I don't know if it started after overheating, after replacing the water pump, or after replacing the hoses. Basically I had to draw a line with a sharpie 2 months ago to watch it drop.No obvious leaks from under the coolant cap, hoses, t-stat housing, or anywhere else. No white smoke. Heat out the vents smells normal, not sugary. There is a small bit of goo at the tip of the oil dipstick however that just started when the temps went down to below freezing, I've checked oil religiously due to an RMS leak and haven't noticed it up until now. Also the other day I noticed large droplets of clear water all the way up the dipstick, which looked to me like condensation.Would a headgasket leak this slowly? If so would a block tester (liquid type) even be able to detect that small amount of loss? I don't own a compression tester however I will go buy one if you think that would detect a leak. I haven't pulled the carpet up for the heater core because I didn't think that would be bad without smelling glycol.Thoughts??- matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilled man Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 Compression test first then get back to us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wheelsup Posted February 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 Compression test first then get back to usOK will do thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
64pvolvo1800 Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 OK so this is driving me nuts. About 6 months ago my lower radiator hose blew going around 35 mph and the car overheated. Fixed that, filled with coolant by my indy. 1 month later it overheated when my fan relay failed and I drove around with no fan on with the a/c operating. This happened slowly at around 10 mph around 200 feet from my garage, so I drove back and parked it.I replaced the water pump, t-stat, ECT, and hoses around 1 month after that.It has now been another 2 months. Car has lost around 1 cm worth of coolant as measured on the coolant tank when cold in the past 1500 miles or so. So slowly that I don't know if it started after overheating, after replacing the water pump, or after replacing the hoses. Basically I had to draw a line with a sharpie 2 months ago to watch it drop.No obvious leaks from under the coolant cap, hoses, t-stat housing, or anywhere else. No white smoke. Heat out the vents smells normal, not sugary. There is a small bit of goo at the tip of the oil dipstick however that just started when the temps went down to below freezing, I've checked oil religiously due to an RMS leak and haven't noticed it up until now. Also the other day I noticed large droplets of clear water all the way up the dipstick, which looked to me like condensation.Would a headgasket leak this slowly? If so would a block tester (liquid type) even be able to detect that small amount of loss? I don't own a compression tester however I will go buy one if you think that would detect a leak. I haven't pulled the carpet up for the heater core because I didn't think that would be bad without smelling glycol.Thoughts??- matt1 cm is no big deal. There is a very good chance that's simply expansion contraction and nothing more. Also, it could simply have been trapped air that finally worked it's way out. I would watch the tank religously and get back to us when it truly is losing coolant. That's the best case. Now the bad.... if you overheated it twice, or ran it without coolant at all when the radiator hose blew, there IS a very good chance you lost soem measure of engine life. Unless it starts presenting problems, consider yourself lucky and let it ride. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wheelsup Posted February 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 1 cm is no big deal. There is a very good chance that's simply expansion contraction and nothing more. Also, it could simply have been trapped air that finally worked it's way out. I would watch the tank religously and get back to us when it truly is losing coolant. That's the best case. Now the bad.... if you overheated it twice, or ran it without coolant at all when the radiator hose blew, there IS a very good chance you lost soem measure of engine life. Unless it starts presenting problems, consider yourself lucky and let it ride.I thought it was simply expansion and contraction but again over time it has gone down a measurable amount so I know something is up. I check it after the car has been sitting overnight and cold. It ran maybe 30 seconds after the low coolant light came on when the hose blow, if that. I shut if off once I got it off to the side of the road. It was idling when I overheated it when the a/c fan relay blew. I guess I just want to know definitively if it is the HG. If it's not I want to fix what is wrong if it's a cheap fix. Even if it is the HG I probably will just drive it and change the oil a little more regularly, because it isn't such a large loss, and to replace the HG I'm looking at $1500 or so and my tranny is already acting up, so to completely replace the driveline on a 14 year old car doesn't make much sense - unfortunately - I love the car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
64pvolvo1800 Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 I thought it was simply expansion and contraction but again over time it has gone down a measurable amount so I know something is up. I check it after the car has been sitting overnight and cold. It ran maybe 30 seconds after the low coolant light came on when the hose blow, if that. I shut if off once I got it off to the side of the road. It was idling when I overheated it when the a/c fan relay blew. I guess I just want to know definitively if it is the HG. If it's not I want to fix what is wrong if it's a cheap fix. Even if it is the HG I probably will just drive it and change the oil a little more regularly, because it isn't such a large loss, and to replace the HG I'm looking at $1500 or so and my tranny is already acting up, so to completely replace the driveline on a 14 year old car doesn't make much sense - unfortunately - I love the car.so how often and how much do you add now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wheelsup Posted February 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 so how often and how much do you add now?I haven't added any in the past two months or so, that was the first time after topping up the tank and replacing the hoses, I added about the same amount as is missing now, and that was after driving about the same amount, so it seems to be a steady, slow, consistent loss. If I were to guess maybe a cup or two to get it back up to the top of the sharpie line (which was maybe 1/2 cm below where the two halves of the expansion tank are mated together), it's down from the sharpie line I drew about 1 cm over the past 2 months which equated to about 1500 miles of driving. So a very slow leak but still a leak none-the-less, which has got me worried. Ozark Lee said it might be the nipple on the expansion tank after losing coolant there isn't any dried or crusty coolant anywhere that I can find. Also no signs of coolant on the ground, from the waterpump, or anywhere else, that would indicate an external leak.What's got me baffled is in the case of it being the HG, typically coolant will boil out from under the expansion tank cap, I can take my cap off even when hot and there is no bubbles. I can idle the car for 5 minutes or more with the cap off and no bubbles. No oil in the coolant, no coolant in the oil (that I can tell). However of note is the level is higher after driving for 10-15 minutes than when completely cold (is this normal or a sign?). I also hear a "whoosh" of air if I take the cap off when hot, but still no bubbles in the coolant that I can tell. In other words is it normal for the level rise slightly when the coolant is hot? Or should it stay the same level at all times? If it's not normal I guess there is my answer. Also I guess a compression test is the most definitive answer? I was reading about someone on here who had a slow coolant loss and their compression was still in the 160's-170's but it was indeed their headgasket. So I was leaning toward buying one of those block testers. I get home on Monday so I guess I'll be able to find out then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T5gruppy Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 Pressure test the cooling system? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
64pvolvo1800 Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 I haven't added any in the past two months or so, that was the first time after topping up the tank and replacing the hoses, I added about the same amount as is missing now, and that was after driving about the same amount, so it seems to be a steady, slow, consistent loss. If I were to guess maybe a cup or two to get it back up to the top of the sharpie line (which was maybe 1/2 cm below where the two halves of the expansion tank are mated together), it's down from the sharpie line I drew about 1 cm over the past 2 months which equated to about 1500 miles of driving. So a very slow leak but still a leak none-the-less, which has got me worried. Ozark Lee said it might be the nipple on the expansion tank after losing coolant there isn't any dried or crusty coolant anywhere that I can find. Also no signs of coolant on the ground, from the waterpump, or anywhere else, that would indicate an external leak.What's got me baffled is in the case of it being the HG, typically coolant will boil out from under the expansion tank cap, I can take my cap off even when hot and there is no bubbles. I can idle the car for 5 minutes or more with the cap off and no bubbles. No oil in the coolant, no coolant in the oil (that I can tell). However of note is the level is higher after driving for 10-15 minutes than when completely cold (is this normal or a sign?). I also hear a "whoosh" of air if I take the cap off when hot, but still no bubbles in the coolant that I can tell. In other words is it normal for the level rise slightly when the coolant is hot? Or should it stay the same level at all times? If it's not normal I guess there is my answer. Also I guess a compression test is the most definitive answer? I was reading about someone on here who had a slow coolant loss and their compression was still in the 160's-170's but it was indeed their headgasket. So I was leaning toward buying one of those block testers. I get home on Monday so I guess I'll be able to find out then.There is an old saying.... "you wanna know how to keep a good hard on?" "simple answer is "don't *&^% with it". Yes the level will rise due to expansion when warm and drop when cold. If all you're adding is 1/2 cup in 1500 miles, let it fly. It doesn't sound,from what you've said, like it really overheated, just got hot and you caught it quick. You can do a compression test and a cooling system pressure test, but in reality, why pour money into it if it's still running well and no real problems have presented. Have a beer and chill out! ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C70 T5M Posted February 8, 2009 Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 Check your heater hoses, they wont leak when the car is off, but will only leak under pressure. I've had this problem on Both of my cars, and is sometimes hard to diagnose.Other option is you may have a crack in your overfill tank, or the hose underneath it. These are all speculations just being added to the associated probables above Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wheelsup Posted February 8, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 but in reality, why pour money into it if it's still running well and no real problems have presented. Have a beer and chill out! I hear ya, my tranny is acting up and I am considering buying one and having it put in but I want to make sure my engine is running well before I drop $1500 or so into the car. If the HG is blown I will do minimal mx on the car until it doesn't run anymore, if it's not blown I am due for a tune up w/ fuel filter, plugs, wires, cap, rotor, etc. and I need to replace my evap as well (will do myself) but that's another $150 or so. It also needs shocks and struts, also $$. I just want to know everything is "OK" in that department before dropping $$ into it. I want to hang onto it for the long haul BUT I also need to know it's not going to cost $1,500 minimum to get it running perfectly before doing anything else.So that's why I want to know definitively. This one has been in my family since new so I know the mx history of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wheelsup Posted February 8, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 Check your heater hoses, they wont leak when the car is off, but will only leak under pressure. I've had this problem on Both of my cars, and is sometimes hard to diagnose.Other option is you may have a crack in your overfill tank, or the hose underneath it. These are all speculations just being added to the associated probables aboveChecked those on the outside of the firewall, still haven't pulled the inside out, I'm home all week so I'm going to do the compression tester, block test, and look in the interior this week to try and isolate the issue.I replaced all the radiator hoses and hoses to and from the tank but haven't touched the heater core hoses yet. But still when I looked at the two on the outside of the firewall they are dry and don't have any green spots or crusty residue on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wheelsup Posted February 9, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 9, 2009 Ok got back, let the car sit overnight 12 hours or so. The level is back up just under the sharpie line. I'm thinking maybe ambient temperature might effect the level? It's 25-30F warmer today than it was the day I checked. What compression tester set would ya'll recommend? I would like one that does a variety of cars because I want to check my VW's as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark_850t Posted February 13, 2009 Report Share Posted February 13, 2009 ok I am replying before I read through the rest of the replies/posts, but also check the coolant overflow tank- There is a seam in the plastic that runs through the middle that eventually leaks. Also that little hose that connects to the overflow tank sometimes will spring a little leak. I had this for a while and finally figured it out- I could also smell coolant through the vents. I was worried it was a head gasket, but my coolant never bubbled and I never saw any other weird symptoms, so I looked further into the coolant overflow tank and hose and found a slow leak in the seam of the overflow tank- check that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wheelsup Posted February 13, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2009 ok I am replying before I read through the rest of the replies/posts, but also check the coolant overflow tank- There is a seam in the plastic that runs through the middle that eventually leaks. Also that little hose that connects to the overflow tank sometimes will spring a little leak. I had this for a while and finally figured it out- I could also smell coolant through the vents. I was worried it was a head gasket, but my coolant never bubbled and I never saw any other weird symptoms, so I looked further into the coolant overflow tank and hose and found a slow leak in the seam of the overflow tank- check thatGot it to my indie today, he presurized the tank and found two small leaks, one was a hose, the other was a small hairline crack in the radiator. So good news/bad news but at least the engine is fine!!Thanks for your thoughts, when I replace the radiator I think I'm going to replace the expansion tank as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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