theForgottenone Posted June 11, 2014 Report Share Posted June 11, 2014 You can't really have any preventative measures against individuals who made up their mind to commit hideous and cowardly act against innocent people. It's the mental resource/help to those that need would benefit for all of these type of tragedy to prevent this type of event. The fast action by the resource police (2) that was at the school and the teacher who was grazed by the bullet to run and notify the school staff to initiate the lock down greatly minimize casualty. As I was leaving for work, i notice the police already have big presence at the intersection (I live 2 blocks away from the school and was the class of 97 of this very same school). Initial thought was that some big accident but as I continue on the commute, I must seen like 50 police cars, EMS, undercover agent in various form heading toward that way so I knew something was up. I blame the society with social media and emergent of internet that cause those who seek fame to act out in this fashion manner from copy cat method of Kip Kinkel. ------------------------------------------------------------ Other solutions such as metal detectors would have done nothing to prevent Tuesday's shooting, Bond said. Metal detectors, Bond said, are good for addressing ongoing gang violence or other problems that cause students to bring weapons to school on a regular basis. But they won't help in a situation where a shooter is intent on killing indiscriminately. That was the case in 2005 when a student in Red Lake, Minn., encountered a metal detector, killed the guard, then went on to kill six other people at the school. Still, schools are investing in special equipment such as bullet-proof glass, redesigned front entrances and video cameras. Those measures also have limitations, said Bond, who was the principal of Heath High School in West Paduchah, Ky., in 1997 when a student killed three and injured five others. "I know people are trying to find answers," Bond said. "I've been trying to help people find answers for 20 years." -------------------------------------------------------------- On May 20, 1998, Kinkel was suspended pending an expulsion hearing from Thurston High School for being in possession of a loaded, stolen handgun. A friend of Kinkel's had stolen a pistol from the father of one of his friends and arranged to sell the weapon to Kinkel the night before. Kinkel paid $110 for the Beretta Model 90 .32-caliber pistol loaded with a 9-round magazine, which he then placed in a paper bag and left in his locker. When the father discovered he was missing a handgun, he reported it to the police and supplied the names of students he believed might have stolen the firearm. Kinkel's name was not on the list. The school became aware of his possible involvement and questioned him. When he was checked for weapons, he reportedly stated: "Look, I'm gonna be square with you guys; the gun's in my locker." Kinkel was suspended pending an expulsion hearing from Thurston High School, and he and his friend were arrested. Kinkel was released from police custody and driven home by his father. Murder of parents At home that afternoon, Kinkel was told by his father that he would be sent to military school if he did not change his behavior.[2] According to Kinkel's taped confession, at about 3:00 p.m. his father was seated at the kitchen counter drinking coffee. Kinkel retrieved his .22 rifle from his bedroom and ammunition from his parents' bedroom. He then went to the kitchen and shot his father once in the back of the head, then dragged his body into the bathroom and covered it with a sheet[1] Kinkel further stated that his mother arrived home at about 6:30 p.m., and that he met her in the garage, told her he loved her, then shot her twice in the back of the head, three times in the face, and once in the heart. He then dragged her body across the floor and covered it with a sheet.[1] Throughout that morning Kinkel repeatedly played a recording of "Liebestod", the final dramatic aria from Wagner's opera Tristan und Isolde, on the family's sound system.[citation needed] The recording was featured in the 1996 film Romeo + Juliet, and included on the compact disc (CD) of the soundtrack from the film. When police arrived at the residence they found "opera music" from the soundtrack playing loudly with the CD player set to continuous play.[1] In a note Kinkel left on a coffee table in the living room, he described his motive for killing his parents thus: "I just got two felonies on my record. My parents can't take that! It would destroy them. The embarrassment would be too much for them. They couldn't live with themselves." But as the note continues, he attempts to describe his mental state: "My head just doesn't work right. God damn these VOICES inside my head. ... I have to kill people. I don't know why. ... I have no other choice."[3] Shooting On May 21, Kinkel drove his mother's Ford Explorer to the high school. He wore a trench coat to hide the five weapons he carried: two hunting knives, a 9mm Glock 19 pistol, a Ruger .22-caliber semi-automatic rifle, and a .22-caliber Ruger MK II pistol. He was carrying 1,127 rounds of ammunition.[4] He parked on North 61st Street, two blocks from the school, then jogged to the campus, entered the patio area and fired two shots, one fatally wounding Ben Walker and the other wounding Ryan Atteberry. Kinkel went to the cafeteria and, walking across it, fired the remaining 48 rounds from his rifle, wounding 24 students[5] and killing 17-year-old Mikael Nickolauson. Kinkel fired a total of 50 rounds, striking 37 people, killing two.[4] When Kinkel's rifle ran out of ammunition and he began to reload, wounded student Jacob Ryker tackled him, assisted by several other students. Kinkel drew the Glock and fired one shot before he was disarmed, injuring Ryker again as well as another student. The students restrained Kinkel until the police arrived and arrested him.[6] A total of seven students were involved in subduing and disarming Kinkel.[7] Nickolauson died at the scene; Walker died after being transported to the hospital and kept on life support until his parents arrived. The other students, including Ryker, were also taken to the hospital with a variety of wounds. Ryker had a perforated lung, but he made a full recovery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fudge_Brownie Posted June 11, 2014 Report Share Posted June 11, 2014 An excellent description on why you can't hide from crazy. Make the school a fortress and you can just open fire on people as they enter or exit. Fix that and there's still being an asshole on the bus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyfishing3 Posted August 7, 2014 Report Share Posted August 7, 2014 about time some of these murderers, get theirs. http://online.wsj.com/articles/detroit-area-man-convicted-of-second-degree-murder-in-porch-shooting-case-1407438587 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JOHN_CENA Posted August 8, 2014 Report Share Posted August 8, 2014 Since when the the WSJ have a paywall? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyfishing3 Posted August 8, 2014 Report Share Posted August 8, 2014 whats a paywall? its free for me to read Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burn-E Posted August 8, 2014 Report Share Posted August 8, 2014 Since when the the WSJ have a paywall? WSJ has had a paywall for almost a decade. Where have you been? However searching for the article on Google gains you access to most articles there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fudge_Brownie Posted August 8, 2014 Report Share Posted August 8, 2014 whats a paywall? its free for me to readPaywall means something pops up over the article/content with a request to login, or some advertisement to sign up for their services. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timbo Slice Posted August 9, 2014 Report Share Posted August 9, 2014 Actually I was heavily considering the FNP but for the price and quality I really couldn't pass up the CZ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OptimusGlen Posted August 9, 2014 Report Share Posted August 9, 2014 CZs are excellent, one of the best feeling guns I've ever shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piston Slapper Posted August 9, 2014 Report Share Posted August 9, 2014 Actually I was heavily considering the FNP but for the price and quality I really couldn't pass up the CZ. Definitely get an FNX instead of an FNP if you do get one, same thing just an updated design with a few kinks worked out. FNP was designed to be a 45 ACP for the Army as part of a proposal to replace the M9 that didn't get approved. Only functions perfectly with NATO ball ammunition. The FNX is a redesign to handle the various shapes/sizes/weights of commercial ammunition. No point getting it in any other caliber. CZs are great for 9x19, heavy enough there's very little felt recoil. How much was it? New or used? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piston Slapper Posted August 9, 2014 Report Share Posted August 9, 2014 Actually, they've done research in the UK that specifically demonstrates these very trends that Erik mentions. I'll have to dig up the data. But it's not a partisan effort. And Mike will tell you, I'm not pro or anti gun. I'm more pro understanding what the data really tells you. Yeah... research done in the UK to attempt to justify their insane ban on pretty much every method of self defense that's caused a huge spike in violent crime? I'm sure that's not biased at all. And again, "research" done by anyone for any reason that states something is more likely to happen when it's physically possible than when it's physically impossible doesn't really mean anything and has nothing to do with how likely it is to actually happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyfishing3 Posted August 9, 2014 Report Share Posted August 9, 2014 Basically. And you mean bender? I don't ever carry with me when I'm doing any kind of drinking or even the possibility of it. Just because I drink, that means I can't but a gun? I wasn't aware of that rule. If gun possession and alcohol weren't allowed, the south would have nothing to do. ZINGGGGGG. is your gun in a safe? for the next couple years you will be living in apartments. where is the gun currently? edit…., i guess you shouldn't say where it is, but you get my point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piston Slapper Posted August 9, 2014 Report Share Posted August 9, 2014 A defensive gun shouldn't just be left in a safe, it keeps you from being able to have it ready to fire before an attacker gets to you, especially in an apartment. "But what if you're not at home?" Well then it should be in your holster. If you can't carry it with you, then and only then do you put it in a safe when you're not at home. Oh, and pistol safes are not hard for a burglar to get into or simply take entirely... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyfishing3 Posted August 9, 2014 Report Share Posted August 9, 2014 thats my point, he says he doesn't go out with it. He's a young guy in a fun town, i'd be out chasing tail all the time. can't take it to gym, can't ride TT bike with it. The apartment isn't safe to leave it. No way leave it in car. Why have it. extra dick inches? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piston Slapper Posted August 9, 2014 Report Share Posted August 9, 2014 thats my point, he says he doesn't go out with it. He's a young guy in a fun town, i'd be out chasing tail all the time. can't take it to gym, can't ride TT bike with it. The apartment isn't safe to leave it. No way leave it in car. Why have it. extra dick inches? Apartment is plenty safe to leave it in if he gets a real safe, not one of the little pistol boxes. A locked volvo trunk with the seat backs locks is more secure than your average full size safe and you can bolt a safe into it if you're ultra paranoid. No reason you can't holster it and ride a bike, I've seen tons of people do that. There's plenty of gyms with secure lockers that let you carry in and out, just look for a gym that LEOs use. Why have it? Because there's no other way to effectively stop a determined attacker. I know you're a gun hating hippie, but you can't honestly tell me you can take a 7' tall muscular thug in a fist fight and wouldn't use a gun if it was either that or be beaten to death. The only people in favor of gun control and public disarmament are either ignorant or criminal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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