Evolve End-links

[Slater]

why do you say that? Slater at least can articulate the benefits and flaws in parts he has apperantly had in hand and evaluated. i would expect from all the bashing (sorry we're not calling it bashing it's "something else") that at this point it's obvious i'm asking for help in reversing a poorly informed descision based on facts, and not pictures. i have the evolve ones and admit to the deficiencies; i'm looking for something that works that i can get now.

Well if you can wait 2 weeks, you CAN get something that works now. And like I said I will give you a $100 credit on my links as a trade-in for your Evolve kit. You're not going to get that with IPD.

As far as IPD links, they are only a slightly heavier duty version of the crappy stock design. They will still flex and the ball joints still have a rubber boot that will tear and pound out eventually. The rods on the stock end links are 0.40" thick. IPDs are slightly thicker (0.50" I believe). The rods I use are 3/4" thick. So they will NOT flex no matter what load is put on them.

However, with that said, tell me a little about your car's setup and what you use it for. Is the car lowered? Does it have upgraded struts? Do you race the car at all? Do you NEED adjustability? What about sway bars - stock, or upgraded?

If your car is lowered, the end link ends will be put at more of an angle. This causes the boots to tear on the stock and IPD end links because the boot is stretched so much. The beauty of the performance endlinks like QBM, Evolve, VMS, etc is that they are adjustable in length. They can be adjusted to suit your driving style, and most importantly can be adjusted to remove any preload on the sway bars. In addition, the rod ends have a much higher range of motion - much mroe than any stock/IPD ball joint style end link. This means that they can handle lowered cars wih ease. Now, I should mention that this is ONLY possible with TAPERED misalignment spacers that ALLOW the rod end to move in a full range of motion. If there are no spacers, and you have a 90 degree nut or some other ghetto way to space the rod ends out to the correct amount, it will actually REDUCE the range of the rod end causing massive binding and big problems. Finally, the heim joint rod ends used on the QUALITY performance adjustable and links are 100% sealed and do not require maintanance. Just because a rod end is "teflon lined" does not mean it is sealed. The rod ends I use an expensive and very strong teflon/kevlar lining, and they are 100% sealed. No greasing, no wearing out. In other words, 100% maintanance free. This is why I put a LIFETIME warranty on my end links kits. You will not get that with Evolve or IPD.

Another thing to think about is the studs on stock/IPD links. Many people have reported the ball joint studs shearing off or stripping for one reason or another (corrosion, age, overtorquing, etc). Once that happens the end link is junk and must be thrown away. The QBM links use Grade 8 bolts and grade 8 nylon lock nuts. If you ever have a problem with the bolt or nut, you can replace it with parts available at any hardware store.

I am not saying the QBM links are for everyone. If all you want to do is replace the terrible stock links then IPDs heavy duty links are fine. But if your car is lowered, used for spirited street driving, weekend or full time racing, or has other performance suspension components you will greatly benefit from an adjustable endlink.

If you have any other questions, feel free to post and I will do my best to answer them. There is so much misinformation and smoke and mirrors out there, it's hard to sift through the BS and know what to believe even from the manufacturers (just like your comment about using the Internet as the LAST place for information). I'm here to help, regardless as to whather you buy anything from me or not. It's not like I am a millionaire from selling the things I do. I could care less. I make very little and in many cases lose money - I do it as a hobby for the love of Volvo.

- Slater

I cant wait for a set of slaters endlinks for my 850

You're gonna get one of the new version too. Just wait...

[merlin390]

Slater You're gonna get one of the new version too. Just wait...

[Slater]

because "i needed something now because i have garage time scheduled" and that's next week. it's as simple as that. i'm working with 6 vendors on the project, and nobody has hit their quoted delivery by less than 3 weeks. i've delayed the project 3 weeks already.

by the way i didn't notice before but IPD only has front end-links. i know the rears are really short, but i would rather replace both. so i guess I go with EVOLVE anyway, and when Slater get's his done, maybe i'll replace them. i have another scheduled project in April.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Slater by the way where is your website so i can track availability? thanks.

other than that i think this thread has run it's course...

Sorry, I just saw this post.

If you have garage time scheduled that cannot be changed I completely understand. You have to do what you have to do. Personally if I were in your shoes I would either 1. take Evolve up on their offer of a full refund, and keep the stock links you have until April when the garage can install some QBM links or 2. install Evolve's links now, hope you don't experience the problems others have reported between now and then, remove them in April and have the shop install QBM links (reselling the Evolve links as gently used).

You're right - IPD only has front links. I do not know if they will be releasing rear links. I doubt it. EVERY P2 car has front links, but only a few models have a rear sway bar. So it's a matter of supply and demand. Tooling on parts like their HD links are not cheap, so there has to be real sales numbers there to support the investment in tooling. They can't have stacks of rear HD links to the ceiling just to sell a few a year, when the front links are outselling the rear 20:1.

As far as my site, it's www.quickbrickmotorsports. However, it is still in the works as I have been very ill the last few months and have not had time to finish it. In fact, the P2 links should have been done months ago but my health took #1 priority since fall last year.

Also, we are all a Volvo family here - no one should feel outcasted coming here. The sarcasm is just friendly atmosphere. We would love to see pics of your S80 when you feel like sharing. It sounds like you have some major upgrades planned, which would be cool to see in my book. I also have a P2 V70 which is your S80's sibling anyways, so depending on what you have in the works I could use some good ideas.

[Big Will]

Slater,

You the man. Way to bring this thread back to awesomeness. Can't wait for your next batch of P1 links to be available.

--Will

[Slater]

Slater,

You the man. Way to bring this thread back to awesomeness. Can't wait for your next batch of P1 links to be available.

--Will

Thanks. Once they are ready I will be doing a detailed page on my site that highlights each feature. Basically things to look for and help make a descision. If you are considering upgraded links, it will be easy to cut through the crap and compare apples and apples.

The P1 links are going to be awesome. Not that the previous versions weren't. But I upgraded the P1 links one final time (i.e. v4) making them the "ultimate".

[SkyWriter]

Slater, i think i learned more in this last page than i have in a month. thanks for taking the time to address all the relevant issues. you hit on the combination i was most worried about : lowering springs (Eibach) with IPD sway bars, and Bilstein HD struts. there's a lot of mods in that suspension, and it became quite clear my driving style (wild to say the least) only exacerbated the setup when i blew my strut towor mount strut rod end right out of the tower. now that it's fixed i hope to install the end-links, and the lowering springs at the same time as i replace all the strut tower mounts, and spring seats all fresh and setup nice. that being the case, i'll put the EVOLVE's in and stand in line at QBM for a much cleaner endlink solution in april when i rework the full exhaust (Ferrita), turbo's (Cherry) and exhaust manifolds (VMS) (hopefully sooner depending on my timing).

if anything, i'll learn something to contribute back to the board about end-links. i think it's only fair.

thanks for the great info; and don't worry about the jab's, it ain't nothing compared to what i have to put up with from the wife

thanks again!

Sky

[Slater]

Slater, i think i learned more in this last page than i have in a month. thanks for taking the time to address all the relevant issues. you hit on the combination i was most worried about : lowering springs (Eibach) with IPD sway bars, and Bilstein HD struts. there's a lot of mods in that suspension, and it became quite clear my driving style (wild to say the least) only exacerbated the setup when i blew my strut towor mount strut rod end right out of the tower. now that it's fixed i hope to install the end-links, and the lowering springs at the same time as i replace all the strut tower mounts, and spring seats all fresh and setup nice. that being the case, i'll put the EVOLVE's in and stand in line at QBM for a much cleaner endlink solution in april when i rework the full exhaust (Ferrita), turbo's (Cherry) and exhaust manifolds (VMS) (hopefully sooner depending on my timing).

if anything, i'll learn something to contribute back to the board about end-links. i think it's only fair.

thanks for the great info; and don't worry about the jab's, it ain't nothing compared to what i have to put up with from the wife

thanks again!

Sky

Sounds like a good plan!

Good luck with the project.

- Slater

[Nebor]

Slater, i think i learned more in this last page than i have in a month. thanks for taking the time to address all the relevant issues. you hit on the combination i was most worried about : lowering springs (Eibach) with IPD sway bars, and Bilstein HD struts. there's a lot of mods in that suspension, and it became quite clear my driving style (wild to say the least) only exacerbated the setup when i blew my strut towor mount strut rod end right out of the tower. now that it's fixed i hope to install the end-links, and the lowering springs at the same time as i replace all the strut tower mounts, and spring seats all fresh and setup nice. that being the case, i'll put the EVOLVE's in and stand in line at QBM for a much cleaner endlink solution in april when i rework the full exhaust (Ferrita), turbo's (Cherry) and exhaust manifolds (VMS) (hopefully sooner depending on my timing).

if anything, i'll learn something to contribute back to the board about end-links. i think it's only fair.

thanks for the great info; and don't worry about the jab's, it ain't nothing compared to what i have to put up with from the wife

thanks again!

Sky

What are your plans for when your Cherry turbos blow your transaxle to pieces?

[dancetheman]

another happy customer...$100 credit for QBM endlinks is an awesome deal...and he's right you can't bend these endlinks...i tried ;)

[SkyWriter]

What are your plans for when your Cherry turbos blow your transaxle to pieces?

repairit, and add NOS, and try it again :D

[Nebor]

replace it, and add NOS

Replace it with what? You could hit 400hp on stock turbos with an S80, which would destroy the already frail transmission.... So what do you replace it with?

[javadoc]

Slater You're gonna get one of the new version too. Just wait...

Fo Shizzle. Will, you got me on the list w/Slater, right? :) :)

[SkyWriter]

Replace it with what? You could hit 400hp on stock turbos with an S80, which would destroy the already frail transmission.... So what do you replace it with?

same thing, donno, give me some ideas (in another thread this one is done)

[WhiteT5]

What are your plans for when your Cherry turbos blow your transaxle to pieces?

The S80 uses a GM tranny, right? Seems like one could source some high strength parts for a rebuild.

Back relatively on topic though, Slater, quick question. I have the V1 endlinks and after seeing the later revisions in which you could use a wrench to hold the link itself in place while you tightened the ends, something came to mind. Do you think it would be wise or doable for that matter to machine two flat areas onto the V1 links so that you could use a wrench for adjustment on them as well? I've been using vice grips, which work, but they just require a little more work.

[Slater]

The S80 uses a GM tranny, right? Seems like one could source some high strength parts for a rebuild.

Back relatively on topic though, Slater, quick question. I have the V1 endlinks and after seeing the later revisions in which you could use a wrench to hold the link itself in place while you tightened the ends, something came to mind. Do you think it would be wise or doable for that matter to machine two flat areas onto the V1 links so that you could use a wrench for adjustment on them as well? I've been using vice grips, which work, but they just require a little more work.

Stick with the vice grips. Flats deep enough to hold properly will make the walls thinner and weaker. Also, if you've ever dealt with adjustable rods with 2 flats machined into them, you will learn to hate them because they round off way too easily and are a general PITA because the flats never seem to be at the right spot to get a wrench where you need it. That is why I switched to hex rods on the V2 and up.

Technically you shouldn't be adjusting the links every week. Unless you make a major change, just set it and forget it.