Che'_Moderator Posted October 30, 2006 Report Share Posted October 30, 2006 If we were to leave Iraq now then things would really go to hell fast. Show me one thing the UN hasn't screwed up. We need to get the reporters out of the warzone and let the soldiers do their jobs. The reality of war does not need to be pumped into every livingroom in America so people can watch it over dinner.You mean americans do not need to know things like how we shelled our own troops to euthanize them after Korean troops crucified them. Oh how a 18 year old kid can not shoot a military combatent with a 50cal while hes getting shot at? Or maybe all the troops still using grapeshot. Or what a cut down looks like in a sand storm............Ok hippies, should we leave Iraq? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoony Posted October 30, 2006 Report Share Posted October 30, 2006 I think it's too late to leave. We need to finish what was started. I personally don't want to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Che'_Moderator Posted October 31, 2006 Report Share Posted October 31, 2006 I think it's too late to leave. We need to finish what was started. I personally don't want to go.Your security policy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
///RonalT5 Posted October 31, 2006 Report Share Posted October 31, 2006 I will tell you again, the Kurds were not associated with the Iranians. They were fighting a small civil war against the Iraqi Govt, And regardless of whether they were or not, you are still condoning their genocide.And I ask you again, where is this info in writing? You just swung from they didn't have anything against Iraq to having a 'small' civil war. I am not condoning their genocide, but I think it is part of third world tactic that is disgraceful. A small group fights againtst a larger group, they are going to slaughter them. It is happening all over the world, and this was not a main reason for going into Iraq, is it? On top of that, I do believe that we should be harsh and fight a war on terrorism, but we should not force a democracy on a country that has never experienced democracy, that is why we will be there for so long and we will never kill all the insurgents. In my view, I don't think we should fully pull out, but this war is going no where and it will just spiral downhill, with more U.S. soldiers killed, and we will have accomplished nothing, because you kill one terrorist, three spring up. I am not a hippie, I just think that this war is going nowhere, and if we need a switch in power, then so be it. This way isn't working now and no one can make assumptions as to what the democrats do until it happens.~Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Che'_Moderator Posted October 31, 2006 Report Share Posted October 31, 2006 And I ask you again, where is this info in writing? ~MikeTip: Whenever you see that, give up. Anyone that conventional cannot handle the real truth on matters of this scale. They enjoy their safety box and are incappable of knowing what goes on outside of it. Don't talk down to them just agree to disagree. God damn hippies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
///RonalT5 Posted October 31, 2006 Report Share Posted October 31, 2006 (edited) Tip: Whenever you see that, give up. Anyone that conventional cannot handle the real truth on matters of this scale. They enjoy their safety box and are incappable of knowing what goes on outside of it. Don't talk down to them just agree to disagree. God Darn hippiesThe point is that I found a couple links supporting my claims, I am curious to see if he has any links himself. + 1, I am not a hippie... +2, your statement is so ignorant cause if you just accept what someone tells you, you are brain-dead, just like everyone agreeing with Bush up to this point (up to 2005 was ok cause we had everything under control)...~Mike Edited October 31, 2006 by EvolveT5R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USMC850T Posted October 31, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2006 The point is that I found a couple links supporting my claims, I am curious to see if he has any links himself. + 1, I am not a hippie... +2, your statement is so ignorant cause if you just accept what someone tells you, you are brain-dead, just like everyone agreeing with Bush up to this point (up to 2005 was ok cause we had everything under control)...~MikeDo some research on your own, the CIA factbook is an excellent reference. If all else fails, Wikipedia it for some general background knowledge, which you are certainly bereft of when it comes to the history of this region beyond a few years ago. Yes, the kurds were involved in a defacto, not dejuris civil war prior to ODS. You may be citing information relavent to other segments of the kurdish population outside the Iraqi borders. If you aren't, then I guess you're wrong. That's something you'll have to come to terms with on your own though.Che is also telling me to stop beating a dead horse, not to accept what someone is telling me. Oh and just because someone agrees with Bush, or posesses a realist ideology pertaining to geopolitical relations doesn't mean that they are ignorant. It may in fact be quite to the contrary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Che'_Moderator Posted October 31, 2006 Report Share Posted October 31, 2006 Che is also telling me to stop beating a dead horse, not to accept what someone is telling me.And you expect him to follow along how? Ironic he made my point for me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAzOR Posted October 31, 2006 Report Share Posted October 31, 2006 (edited) Do some research on your own, the CIA factbook is an excellent reference. If all else fails, Wikipedia it for some general background knowledge, which you are certainly bereft of when it comes to the history of this region beyond a few years ago. Yes, the kurds were involved in a defacto, not dejuris civil war prior to ODS. You may be citing information relavent to other segments of the kurdish population outside the Iraqi borders. If you aren't, then I guess you're wrong. That's something you'll have to come to terms with on your own though.Che is also telling me to stop beating a dead horse, not to accept what someone is telling me. Oh and just because someone agrees with Bush, or posesses a realist ideology pertaining to geopolitical relations doesn't mean that they are ignorant. It may in fact be quite to the contrary.When W talks about winning the war, I believe he is narrowly, but correctly referring to the main effort of setting up a functional and powerful central government of Iraq and its full control of an effective military. The transition of power and full military control should take place sometime next year. It is then up to the Iraqis. EVOLVE I think what you and so many others like you are getting at is at best an ill-defined criteria for victory. Think about this:What would we (the US) have to acheive for YOU to consider it a victory? Think about that. Think if it is practical and realistic. It may not be. We ALL want the same thing. We just have differing paradigms, perspectives, and conditions for progress and victory.At least in this war, we all support our soldiers and that is very, very encouraging. My hat's off to Evolve and the other peace proponents for their support of the fighting men and women. With your ideology largely out of power for so many years, it must be hard to oppose and support such a heavy issue at the same time. But at least you see the seriousness of the situation. And take heart and remember that thanks to W and his strength, this isn't over. Not by a long shot. And those who support W's strategy (such as USMC and myself) could very well end up be right and winning this- an outcome that is, regardless of ideolgoy, a huge win for all of us. Edited October 31, 2006 by RAzOR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoony Posted October 31, 2006 Report Share Posted October 31, 2006 Your security policy?I figured the military wouldn't support anybody who has an NA. It's easier then shooting my toe off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
///RonalT5 Posted October 31, 2006 Report Share Posted October 31, 2006 (edited) When W talks about winning the war, I believe he is narrowly, but correctly referring to the main effort of setting up a functional and powerful central government of Iraq and its full control of an effective military. The transition of power and full military control should take place sometime next year. It is then up to the Iraqis. EVOLVE I think what you and so many others like you are getting at is at best an ill-defined criteria for victory. Think about this:What would we (the US) have to acheive for YOU to consider it a victory? Think about that. Think if it is practical and realistic. It may not be. We ALL want the same thing. We just have differing paradigms, perspectives, and conditions for progress and victory.At least in this war, we all support our soldiers and that is very, very encouraging. My hat's off to Evolve and the other peace proponents for their support of the fighting men and women. With your ideology largely out of power for so many years, it must be hard to oppose and support such a heavy issue at the same time. But at least you see the seriousness of the situation. And take heart and remember that thanks to W and his strength, this isn't over. Not by a long shot. And those who support W's strategy (such as USMC and myself) could very well end up be right and winning this- an outcome that is, regardless of ideolgoy, a huge win for all of us.+1 dude, thanks for your real responce, I appreciate it! I don't agree with Bush on this one, but I will wait it out with good intentions. Who knows, maybe I am wrong and this will all come out perfectly, but time will tell. We all want the same thing: peace and the terrorists to drop off the face of the earth, it is just how we interperate how to meet these objectives. Nice debating! ~Mike Edited October 31, 2006 by EvolveT5R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAzOR Posted October 31, 2006 Report Share Posted October 31, 2006 (edited) +1 dude, thanks for your real responce, I appreciate it! I don't agree with Bush on this one, but I will wait it out with good intentions. Who knows, maybe I am wrong and this will all come out perfectly, but time will tell. We all want the same thing: peace and the terrorists to drop off the face of the earth, it is just how we interperate how to meet these objectives. Nice debating! ~MikeLike wise. That's one thing that makes this country so great. And you mean (as do I) "I hope to God Bush is right". Edited October 31, 2006 by RAzOR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
///RonalT5 Posted October 31, 2006 Report Share Posted October 31, 2006 And you mean (as do I) "I hope to God Bush is right".You got it. He isn't a bad guy, actually prett cool in public. I just don't agree with his tactics, haha.~Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAzOR Posted October 31, 2006 Report Share Posted October 31, 2006 You got it. He isn't a bad guy, actually prett cool in public. I just don't agree with his tactics, haha.~MikeYeah. I think he is a good guy and am sure knows how to drink and have a good time. But he is a horrifically bad public speaker. Maybe "dain bramage" from too much alcohol in his younger days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
///RonalT5 Posted October 31, 2006 Report Share Posted October 31, 2006 Yeah. I think he is a good guy and am sure knows how to drink and have a good time. But he is a horrifically bad public speaker. Maybe "dain bramage" from too much alcohol in his younger days.HAHA, ya. I would think it would be cool to have him as an uncle or something, haha.~Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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