thelostartof Posted January 10, 2007 Report Share Posted January 10, 2007 yes you CAN use a vanos head on a non vanos block .... also you can disable the cam ... i do not remember how but i know it has been donetalk to Peter L over on TB as he has that setup on his 960turbo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricF Posted January 10, 2007 Report Share Posted January 10, 2007 Best to start with a turbo block. No one in Sweden really uses LPT or NA blocks with the bigger bore in performance builds, that says a lot (much higher volume of buildups over there than over here). The cylinder walls are just thin (Mike, think of Chris' 960).What is your goal? Just to build an engine and have it be turbocharged in the end and have decent performance? Or something more? I have a turbo 850 block if you'd like one to start with, and various bottom end pieces and heads... Let me know if you are interested.Mike, there are a few different head castings... I have heads off of NA cars that are the same as the turbo head (I know, makes no sense because the bigger intake manifold ports and variable intake geometry), and I also have a couple that are different cast numbers which are the same thing. I haven't messed with enough of them to really get any rules afoot but I do know that they are probably not all exactly as VADIS would suggest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keaton85 Posted January 10, 2007 Report Share Posted January 10, 2007 so if i was to make a good turbo engine i should go with a 2.3L block, turbo head, stock rods and maybe S60R pistons? I'm looking on a cheap 300HP area not 350WHP+ build by using used parts i have around the shop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricF Posted January 10, 2007 Report Share Posted January 10, 2007 so if i was to make a good turbo engine i should go with a 2.3L block, turbo head, stock rods and maybe S60R pistons? I'm looking on a cheap 300HP area not 350WHP+ build by using used parts i have around the shop.2.3 liter block, upgraded H-beam rods, and stock oversized pistons (most people go for the .040" over second oversize). The stock head is fine if you don't want that much power and have a decently sized turbo and nice intercooler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keaton85 Posted January 10, 2007 Report Share Posted January 10, 2007 2.3 liter block, upgraded H-beam rods, and stock oversized pistons (most people go for the .040" over second oversize). The stock head is fine if you don't want that much power and have a decently sized turbo and nice intercooler.how much do the h-beams and oversized pistons run normaly?... isnt the only thing i can do to the head is get it ported and poilished? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N/A Kid Posted January 10, 2007 Report Share Posted January 10, 2007 hypothetical situation...if i were to build a turbo to swap into my n/a would it be possible to retain my 5 speed tranny or would that not work for whatever reason? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oreo931 Posted January 10, 2007 Report Share Posted January 10, 2007 hypothetical situation...if i were to build a turbo to swap into my n/a would it be possible to retain my 5 speed tranny or would that not work for whatever reason?Well, I dont know what you mean by "build a turbo" but if you are referring to building a turbocharged engine or buying one, then yes you could swap it into your NA and have one of the few 850 Turbos that is a manual in the US. The tranny would work fine.Reading this thread made some gears move in my head...I was thinking about how before I actually bought a RWD car I was considering buying an n/a 740 and doing a +T on it because it was inexpensive and relatively easy. If you asked "can I turbo my NA on Tbricks the response would be sure! heres how... Now if you asked that same question on VS everyone would say "n00b, buy a turbo"... Is the level of difficulty of +T'ing a redblock much less than +T'ing a whiteblock (thats what our 850's/x70's have, right?)...If it is as easy as doing on a RWD it is definitely something I will look into. Any input? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fitzy Posted January 10, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 10, 2007 Best to start with a turbo block. No one in Sweden really uses LPT or NA blocks with the bigger bore in performance builds, that says a lot (much higher volume of buildups over there than over here). The cylinder walls are just thin (Mike, think of Chris' 960).What is your goal? Just to build an engine and have it be turbocharged in the end and have decent performance? Or something more? I have a turbo 850 block if you'd like one to start with, and various bottom end pieces and heads... Let me know if you are interested.My plan was to get some form of complete engine or just a block and learn how to properly tear down and assemble. Upgrading was an afterthought, but this idea crossed my mind so I figured it would be worthwhile to ask some questions. The goal, ultimately is to pull the engine in my 850 sometime down the road(months/years) to replace it with one that I've built. It would have to have comparable if not better performance (235-300hp) and be reliable. If those two factors couldn't be met I wouldn't use an NA block and switch to building up a low mileage HPT block to replace the current. Whether or not this actually happens I don't know but its something to shoot for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted January 10, 2007 Report Share Posted January 10, 2007 it is just as easy to turbo a white block as it is to turbo a redblock ..... only thing the white block people do not have is a good tune... where as rwd guys can use factory EMS w/ chips or go standalone cheap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricF Posted January 10, 2007 Report Share Posted January 10, 2007 My plan was to get some form of complete engine or just a block and learn how to properly tear down and assemble. Upgrading was an afterthought, but this idea crossed my mind so I figured it would be worthwhile to ask some questions. The goal, ultimately is to pull the engine in my 850 sometime down the road(months/years) to replace it with one that I've built. It would have to have comparable if not better performance (235-300hp) and be reliable. If those two factors couldn't be met I wouldn't use an NA block and switch to building up a low mileage HPT block to replace the current. Whether or not this actually happens I don't know but its something to shoot for.Well, new pistons are not really necessary so long as the cylinder walls aren't ridiculously oval... Though I would recommend new rings. Which is a problem, because rings are prohibitively expensive last I checked, I mean about the same price as new pistons with rings.Rods I would suggest upgrading just because the stock ones are ridiculously weak and the only real glaring weakness in a bottom end that will have a street/strip or <400 whp tune. It is a lot better to upgrade the rods before you put the engine in than to bend a rod after you've done all that work. They're $500/set with ARP rod bolts from Tuff240 (he has a new company with Stereophile33 which has posted a for sale thread for their rods).Here is a good thread about engine building in general from turbobricks. http://forums.turbobricks.com/showthread.php?t=25895You can learn a lot from that thread about engine building in general, as far as machining costs, what corners to skip and which not to. Etc.Oreo, about the +T issue... It's really better to start with a turbo car. But, if you really want to +T a whiteblock let me know and I'll try to find some of the old threads about it. Wouldn't hurt to try a search either as it has been talked about before once or twice :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thelostartof Posted January 10, 2007 Report Share Posted January 10, 2007 you sure rings are expensive? i think the last time i priced them it was $80 for a set we also found that audi rings might also fit perfect Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricF Posted January 10, 2007 Report Share Posted January 10, 2007 you sure rings are expensive? i think the last time i priced them it was $80 for a set we also found that audi rings might also fit perfectYou make my day every once in awhile Mike, thanks!Maybe I will build an engine for my 855... Gears-a-turnin'!So yeah, apparently rings are not prohibitively expensive. Time to go check out the ridges at the top of the cylinders in all my blocks in the garage... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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