Pops Racer Posted November 14, 2008 Report Share Posted November 14, 2008 AmEx is looking for a handout now. But I dont really care right now. Cuz I gots me a J-O-B!!Palinishot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyfishing3 Posted November 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2008 with all the bail out talk and corp with their hands out when is the airline industry going to speak up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pops Racer Posted November 18, 2008 Report Share Posted November 18, 2008 They already know how to buy each other and reform into new compamies. Huckabee says buy over stocked cars from Big 3, instead of 25 billion handout, and give 'em to folks that need cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCviggen Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 Huckabee says buy over stocked cars from Big 3, instead of 25 billion handout, and give 'em to folks that need cars.Was he joking or serious? That's one of the most retarded things i've heard yet.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pops Racer Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 Was he joking or serious? That's one of the most retarded things i've heard yet..Hey, it clears inventory, helps out a few folks who need cars and trucks, like small business that needs vans or pickup trucks. And still gives them money to work with. Whats the down side? And its no more retarded than giving them money for a situation they got themselves into. Reward for failure? Why would you keep your 90 yr old, brain dead, grandmother on life support?How about the idea that we give each Tax Payer an equal share of all this bailout money and bad debt? One estimate has it at $425,000 per household. If I got that cash I'd pay off my mortgage. Housing crisis and lending industry, fixed. I'd buy at least one new car. Auto industry, fixed. I'd start savings accounts and investment accounts for me and my kids. Wall Street, fixed. Go on a vacation, airline industry, fixed. And revenue would be collected back in consumption taxes, fees, licensing, employee taxes, and capital gains.Free Market FTWI'd build my garage, build my home theater,( thus employing myself!), buy tools, pave my driveway, paint the inside of my house.And I'd still have $100K in checking and savings accounts for laughs. Now who's retarded? :lol: 50 million households would do the same thing.Just an idea. But it could work.Or we could all by tons of blow and hookers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCviggen Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 The problem with the "proposal" you mentioned is that it sounds logical enough as long as you don't think about it, or know anything about economics. It just wouldn't work, seriously the problems are too numerous to mention.As much as I would love to see GM fail, mathematics suggest that keeping them on life support for the time being is better for everyone (except those interested in good cars obviously). Nobody is "giving" them free money either but the point is that they support such a large number of people that it would cost the government a hell of a lot more money to take over some of GM's obligations, but the economic impact would be even more far reaching. Honestly its the last thing that "we" need right now. Yes they suck and its annoying they will get loans to keep making crappy cars but the alternative is far worse. These things are frikkin complicated even for economists, I don't pretend to know half of it but I'm positive the average Joe doesn't know sh!t about it and the possible consequences.How about the idea that we give each Tax Payer an equal share of all this bailout money and bad debt? One estimate has it at $425,000 per household.Maybe you could check your calculator. For 700 billion to equal 425K "per household" there would have to be only 1.65 million households. The US population stands at around 305,000,000 people. That works out then at 2300$ per person. May still sound like a lot (and it is, obviously) but its a very far cry from 425 grand a family and it wouldn't save the economy by a long shot if it was just handed out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErikS Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 GM and Ford sell more cars overseas now than they do in the US.Huckabee says buy over stocked cars from Big 3, instead of 25 billion handout.Huckabee ran for President? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pops Racer Posted November 20, 2008 Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 The problem with the "proposal" you mentioned is that it sounds logical enough as long as you don't think about it, or know anything about economics. It just wouldn't work, seriously the problems are too numerous to mention.As much as I would love to see GM fail, mathematics suggest that keeping them on life support for the time being is better for everyone (except those interested in good cars obviously). Nobody is "giving" them free money either but the point is that they support such a large number of people that it would cost the government a hell of a lot more money to take over some of GM's obligations, but the economic impact would be even more far reaching. Honestly its the last thing that "we" need right now. Yes they suck and its annoying they will get loans to keep making crappy cars but the alternative is far worse. These things are frikkin complicated even for economists, I don't pretend to know half of it but I'm positive the average Joe doesn't know sh!t about it and the possible consequences.Maybe you could check your calculator. For 700 billion to equal 425K "per household" there would have to be only 1.65 million households. The US population stands at around 305,000,000 people. That works out then at 2300$ per person. May still sound like a lot (and it is, obviously) but its a very far cry from 425 grand a family and it wouldn't save the economy by a long shot if it was just handed out.Why not? You missed what I said. I also included the Debt we are paying off! And I only included folks working between 18-62 yrs old. ANd it was for each household of 4 people. And humor me, please give some of these problems too many to mention. You can't just say that and walk away. And what happens if they default on these loans? Am I now a stock holder of a defunct company, with obsolete plants and products? I realize these are simple ideas, but this other stuff is pure BS. Somebody needs to think differently, instead of the tried and failed practice of throwing money at the problem Congress is beholden to the unions, and thats a big part of what is killing the business. Unless they can cut labor and benny costs by more than half, they are screwed. Plus they pay more in retiree benefits than their existing payroll!It's a big mess. And I'm not confident it will be resolved to the benefit of the citizens of this country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pops Racer Posted November 20, 2008 Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 GM and Ford sell more cars overseas now than they do in the US.Huckabee ran for President? Why does some one have to run for office to have and idea? I'm not hearing anything from any one except throw cash at it all. We've been throwing cash at a broken public ed system for decades to no avail. Why would these plans work any better? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCviggen Posted November 20, 2008 Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 Why not? You missed what I said. I also included the Debt we are paying off! And I only included folks working between 18-62 yrs old. ANd it was for each household of 4 people.A household consisting only of working people between 18-62 doesn't sound typical to me And what debt are you referring to? You want to count people's mortgages and credit card debts as well? I mean...those debts people created all by themselves. Even if you add up everything you can possibly find you still won't be anywhere near that silly number. I found out where the 425K came from by the way, it started when someone divided 85 billion by 200 million over-18 americans. Only he or she put 3 zeroes too much on a billion and ended up with 425K instead of 425$. So again this is just something a regular person, bad at math, came up with on the internets. Its not "some estimate" like there was anyone serious involved. It would have taken you 10 seconds to see it was BS if you took a calculator...I'll humor you on the cars thing :"folks who need cars" would be who exactly? Who decides who gets a car? A giant national lottery? Everybody wants a free car, you'll never be able to weed out those who already have or can afford one. But that's a minor issue compared to this : the whole idea is to "save" the car industry and "help out" some people as a bonus. But would you do any good to the industry buying up their stock and giving it away for free? No, because you are effectively lowering the value of the cars they are trying to sell themselves, similar to inflation when more currency hits the streets. Giving stuff away for free will never, éver help the economy, period. You will get a huge amount of cars dumped into the market, on top of an artificially lowered demand because now less folks need cars. Prices will collapse like a failed pudding and the car makers and the economy are more screwed than before. I won't get into fuel prices, pollution, congestion, or any of that because they are frankly not worth mentioning next to something so catastrophic as the injection of free cars would be to the market.For this very reason, third world countries don't get any food aid unless people are literally starving. Dumping free food is the final neckshot to what's left of their local agriculture/economy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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