850R rebuild update and swaybar question

[Gizmo]

 

My 850R that was smashed on the street back in May is on the mend.

The whole front end was destroyed in this, and now I have to rebuild it from the ground up. Wanted folks' opinions on my sway bar situation.

IIRC, '96 Rs are something like 21mm front sway / 21mm rear. I liked the way the car handled pre-crash, on Koni-yellows, beefy end links and a strut tower brace.

But the front sway got destroyed in the crash (along with the subframe, the steering rack, the transmission... oi)

The donor subframe is off an S70, and has it's stock swaybar (which, IIRC should be a 20mm bar). Also can't get Koni Yellows anymore so I'm going to Bilstien B6s.

Am I going to feel a difference at all going from 21/21 sways to 20/21? I like the idea that it'll rotate a little easier (might put a 22mm on the rear later), but will the 20mm make it feel noticeably softer?

I've got no problem plunking down the cash for an IPD set, but it seems like the consensus is 25/22 makes the car understeer?

 

 

 

[Zappo]

I don't believe you have a 21mm rear as stock.  Volvo never made them square for safety reasons as they wanted it to tend to understeer.  You most likely have a 19mm rear.

You won't notice much difference between the 21 and 20 front, if at all.

[Chuck W]

You might as well install Delrin SF bushings if you have it all apart. 

[Gizmo]

31 minutes ago, Chuck W said:

You might as well install Delrin SF bushings if you have it all apart. 

I was extremely tempted, but in the end went with XC90 bushings.

The car was hit right in the driver's side front wheel while parked on the street, and that buckled the subframe with enough force to pierce the transmission. I figure no small part of why the car is still straight is the old subframe bushings deformed.

Will that one in a million hit ever happen again? no.

Will I angrily take it apart again in a few years to put in the derlin bushings? ha, yeah probably.

 

For kicks, here's what the old subframe looked like:

 

1 hour ago, Zappo said:

I don't believe you have a 21mm rear as stock.  Volvo never made them square for safety reasons as they wanted it to tend to understeer.  You most likely have a 19mm rear.

You won't notice much difference between the 21 and 20 front, if at all.

That makes sense -- I thought square was odd. Thank you.

I figure once I get it on the road again and sort out the body work, I'll probably get a 22 rear off of IPD and see how that suits me.

[Zappo]

I run 25mm front and rear.  You have to be more careful in the snow as the rear will step out on you.

 

[gmsgltr]

same^ the rear of my wagon steps out on mine in the rain too haha

[Gizmo]

Those of you running square, how stiff is the rest of your setup? What shocks/springs, and any chassis stiffening?

Assuming that if I find a front/rear ratio that I like, I can up the stiffness as desired? like, if I find 20/19 to my liking, I can expect reasonably the same out of, say, 25/23?

[Zappo]

Actually, I was wrong.  I am running 25/28.  I used to run 25/25.  At one point iPd used to sell a race setup that was 25/25, along with their current 25/22 upgrade.  

I am running coil overs with adjustable dampening.  Stiffer in the front than the rear. I adjust dampening when I race the car, but that is my normal setup for the street. 
I don't run any chassis bracing, but I do have some very beefy end links.  My wheel offset is higher to clear my brakes, so the track is wider front and rear.  Similar to running spacers with stock wheels.

You will definitely feel the difference between a 25 front vs a 20, even at low speed turns.  A 25/22 will be similar in handling to what you are used to except it will be flatter in cornering as expected.

The Delrin bushings are way easier to install with the frame out than with it in the car.    I did it the hard way.

 

[Gizmo]

According to this old post this old post, a '96 854R would be running 21/20 out of the factory, up from the T5's 20/19.5.

So if this front off the donor S70 is 20mm as it should be, looks like I'll be running square 20/20. Will be interested to see how it handles.