VolFan Posted September 12, 2005 Report Share Posted September 12, 2005 An American citizen can be held IDEFINITELY without due process.I hope you guys grasp this.Civil Liberties Lost! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Che'_Moderator Posted September 12, 2005 Report Share Posted September 12, 2005 An American citizen can be held IDEFINITELY without due process.I hope you guys grasp this.Civil Liberties Lost!←Laws like this are great when your above them. Not real worried. Plus that was a federal court not Bush Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt1122 Posted September 12, 2005 Report Share Posted September 12, 2005 I'm not crying. monkey him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VolFan Posted September 12, 2005 Author Report Share Posted September 12, 2005 So you guys are comfortable with detaining U.S. citizens indefinitely without due process.Do you understand due process? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Che'_Moderator Posted September 12, 2005 Report Share Posted September 12, 2005 So you guys are comfortable with detaining U.S. citizens indefinitely without due process.Do you understand due process?←I'm fine with it. We have been detaining people since the 60s and stripping them of all rights. And yes americans. It happens. Don't be a terrorist! :angry: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VolFan Posted September 12, 2005 Author Report Share Posted September 12, 2005 I'm fine with it. We have been detaining people since the 60s and stripping them of all rights. And yes americans. It happens. Don't be a terrorist! ←Chuck are you serious. "Don't be a terrorist!" The government under Bush can label you an enemy combatant(terrorist), detain you indefinitely and not even have to prove you have any ties to terrorism.Chuck the argument is not whether or not you are a terrorist, it is that the government has removed our constitutional right for due process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VolFan Posted September 12, 2005 Author Report Share Posted September 12, 2005 I'm not crying. monkey him.←Complete ignorance!The law can apply to you as well as any other U.S. citizen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Che'_Moderator Posted September 12, 2005 Report Share Posted September 12, 2005 Chuck are you serious. "Don't be a terrorist!" The government under Bush can label you an enemy combatant(terrorist), detain you indefinitely and not even have to prove you have any ties to terrorism.Chuck the argument is not whether or not you are a terrorist, it is that the government has removed our constitutional right for due process.←They always could. And it has been many times in the past. The government can do whatever it wants to you when it comes right down to it. The key is living in a country where you trust the descression of the body in power. If you don't you should move. I know I would Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StickThatClutch Posted September 12, 2005 Report Share Posted September 12, 2005 (edited) Haha. The Padilla case is so passe. It wasn't Bush that screwed Padilla over. It was the fact that his own defense attorney didn't file the petition in the correct district appeals court. Edited September 12, 2005 by StickThatClutch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EMDII Posted September 12, 2005 Report Share Posted September 12, 2005 So you guys are comfortable with detaining U.S. citizens indefinitely without due process.Do you understand due process?←Is he not a POW and Enemy Combatant?Should my citizenship deter the court fom holding me if I constitute a Clear and Present Danger.Yes, this is a tricky Q. Expound on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zappo Posted September 12, 2005 Report Share Posted September 12, 2005 Is he not a POW and Enemy Combatant?Should my citizenship deter the court fom holding me if I constitute a Clear and Present Danger.Yes, this is a tricky Q. Expound on.←He isn't a POW. Traitor perhaps. Terrorists normally can't be considered POWs when captured because the US isn't at war with the nation they are a citizen of. therefore, they have almost no rights. Padilla is going to be a special case because he does have confirmed links to known terrorists or terrorist organizations. It isn't like they are going to detain you for eatting at a restaraunt that later is found to be funneling money to a terrorist organization. It isn't the same thing, but it isn't clearly defined either, which I believe is the point of the article. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StickThatClutch Posted September 12, 2005 Report Share Posted September 12, 2005 (edited) He isn't a POW. Traitor perhaps. Terrorists normally can't be considered POWs when captured because the US isn't at war with the nation they are a citizen of. therefore, they have almost no rights. Padilla is going to be a special case because he does have confirmed links to known terrorists or terrorist organizations. It isn't like they are going to detain you for eatting at a restaraunt that later is found to be funneling money to a terrorist organization. It isn't the same thing, but it isn't clearly defined either, which I believe is the point of the article.←Actually the way that congress defined a Enemy Combatant under the joint resolution allowing the President to hold people under this definition allows Padilla to be held in this state.http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/20...0011113-27.htmlThe real issue here is the Padilla is a US citizen. If he weren't there wouldn't be such a brewhaha over this case. Under the joint resolution he can be held but under the constitution there are some issues. The problem is which supercedes the other in this case. In theory your constitution rights should be overarching in this respect. However, there is a vague point as to which point you relinquish your citizenship if you choose to attack your own nation.Again, Padilla was given legal counsel. The counsel filed in the wrong circuit of appeals and that's why he's been detained for this long. If they had filed int he correct circuit of appeals to begin with the trial would have been long resolved by now. Edited September 12, 2005 by StickThatClutch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt1122 Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 (edited) "Don't be a terrorist!" The government under Bush can label you an enemy combatant(terrorist), detain you indefinitely and not even have to prove you have any ties to terrorism.Chuck the argument is not whether or not you are a terrorist, it is that the government has removed our constitutional right for due process.←Note: The following is my position on the matter. No personal attacks are intended, even if it pisses you off or seems directly aimed at you.Yeah, because they are going to come after you and me. Shut the hell up. Grow the hell up. No one's out to get you. No one in the government probably even knows who the hell you are. Or cares. Or ever will.Just mind your own business, be a good citizen and you won't have any problems.If you're a terrorist screw the consitution. I have a special amendment just for terrorists I'd propose:-Terrorists are exempt from the entire consitution.There you go.Screw them, screw everyone associated with them, and screw anyone who cares about their rights. If the government says someone is a terrorist I don't care if it's true or not, I'm sure they have a good reason to detain them. This isn't North Korea or a 3rd World Country. You'll be fine. I'll be fine. Everyone who's cool will be fine.If you have a problem with the way things are run go cry to mama. Edited September 13, 2005 by Legend854T5R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seifer850 Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 monkeyin' republicans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Socal Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 (edited) If the government says someone is a terrorist I don't care if it's true or not, I'm sure they have a good reason to detain them. This isn't North Korea or a 3rd World Country. You'll be fine. I'll be fine. Everyone who's cool will be fine.←You won't be fine if its three years of your life down the toilet...or more. I just have to wonder if the council that Padilla has was court appointed or retained by him or his family. A council that doesn't give a Darn or is inept would be like having no help at all in the legal world (and that is a scary thing to think about). The fact that the US Gov droped the allegations that he was part of a dirty-bomb plot and now have some other charge relating to blowing things up makes me think that they don't have any particular charge against this guy. It sets a really bad legal precedent.On a side note: Stephen you sig cracks me up. Even after seeing your car at the meet I still didn't get your sig until a few weeks ago. Edited September 13, 2005 by Socal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts