Iraq Study Group Report

[starfish]

Is that really required?

I am not offended by him and I doubt many could be. When reading his posts observe his distinctive mental suffering and overall lack of coherence caused from a disease known as liberalism, a mental disorder. This often self-imposed disease is getting the best of him, especially so when brought on by acute conservative intelligentsia stimuli.

Show him pity though, you know it is the Holiday season, a tough time for a liberal boy growing up atheist, not knowing the celebration of the Lord and witnessing the exchange of gifts given by people not by the government. Its all very very confusing.

[Greenchunks]

I am not offended by him and I doubt many could be. When reading his posts observe his distinctive mental suffering and overall lack of coherence caused from a disease known as liberalism, a mental disorder. This often self-imposed disease is getting the best of him, especially so when brought on by acute conservative intelligentsia stimuli.

Show him pity though, you know it is the Holiday season, a tough time for a liberal boy growing up atheist, not knowing the celebration of the Lord and witnessing the exchange of gifts given by people not by the government. Its all very very confusing.

Dude, stop slobbering Michael Savage's cock and using his book title in every reference to liberalism. Think for yourself, make your own conclusions instead of just listening to what your church tells you and what ulta conservative op ed writers tell you. And shut the monkey up already with you conservative intelligentsia, you're no poking 'smarter' than anyone here because of your political orientation of political school of though. (based on your posts and lack of an open mind I might even be so daring as to suggest you are less smart) There's plenty of intelligent people on both sides of the coin, and plenty of idiots (we have goddamn native americans and hippies sitting in the poking oak trees they want to cut down to rebuild our football stadium. And there are psycho nut-jobs like yourself on the other side). So please, shut the monkey up already starfish. You are the only person who contributes to the political forum who is soo closed minded and a such a puppet of what they are told. Every other conservative person who posts here has at least a stable mind and can think critically outside of what they read in ridiculous articles, except yourself. Most every single liberal person here is able to admit to mistakes, and can see the other sides reason. So please, I'm sick and tired of you polluting these forums with your spamming I'm dumb, I'd rather jsut see ads for ponies, a limp dick, and Young Coeds who are local and ready to monkey!

[TM850R]

Dude, stop slobbering Michael Savage's cock and using his book title in every reference to liberalism. Think for yourself, make your own conclusions instead of just listening to what your church tells you and what ulta conservative op ed writers tell you. And shut the fuck up already with you conservative intelligentsia, you're no fucking 'smarter' than anyone here because of your political orientation of political school of though. (based on your posts and lack of an open mind I might even be so daring as to suggest you are less smart) There's plenty of intelligent people on both sides of the coin, and plenty of idiots (we have goddamn native americans and hippies sitting in the fucking oak trees they want to cut down to rebuild our football stadium. And there are psycho nut-jobs like yourself on the other side). So please, shut the fuck up already starfish. You are the only person who contributes to the political forum who is soo closed minded and a such a puppet of what they are told. Every other conservative person who posts here has at least a stable mind and can think critically outside of what they read in ridiculous articles, except yourself. Most every single liberal person here is able to admit to mistakes, and can see the other sides reason. So please, I'm sick and tired of you polluting these forums with your spamming bullshit, I'd rather jsut see ads for Cialis, Viagra, and Young Coeds who are local and ready to fuck!

Well starfish, he has a point. I grew up a Roman Catholic without any guidance in politics. My family raised me to believe that I would make my own decisions whether or not they are right or wrong. I grew out of that phase of believing in mulit-millennium old folklore. Plus, religion should have nothing to do with how we view politics. If you are truly by the books, you would know about separation of church and state.

Anyways, back to Iraq. How is that study going USMC850T?

[starfish]

Dude, stop slobbering Michael Savage's cock and using his book title in every reference to liberalism.

Although Savage wrote a popular book titled "Liberalism is a Mental Disorder", he did not coin the phrase nor make claim to it. In fact you can find those words written in books over 100 years ago making them common speak today. With the many political commentators and pundits writting and broadcasting continually there will definetely be some phrases more recognizable than others as being from one individual. Nice try though?

[DVolvoguy850T5]

We have too many hi-tech toys in the military to have the war going on over there to be going like it is. It's all crapola. I agree with one of the above posters, pull out the troops to a safe area and let them do each other in.

Starfish is right in most ways... What is interesting is all these media whores have most of the American's attention diverted to things of decidence (sp?) and things are brewing here behind the scenes that will get them screwed.

The Baker report and the Iraq study report is full of BS for sure. That is wasted tax payer money.

Interestingly Bush (pres) worked for Baker Boc ( an international law firm that represents Saudi Arabia's defence from the 9/11 victems lawsute) when he was 15 in their mail room....

A new Nazi (muslim) regime is building here in the US as around the world. And make no mistake, this is a fact. History is about to repeat it's self again.

Stupid people do stupid things. ( as a result of school kids being taught by liberals ) Most kids I went to school with did not like history or social studys.... it figgures. Now history books are being rewritten to appease the minority's of this country and that will further dumb down kids in school.

All these people will keep watching girls gone wild and stupid "reality tv" and follow the lies that are told on the major networks and Communist News Network, be comfortable the way things are and they will pay.

The Iraq war study is just more fleasing of America.....

Just remember, the second amendment was drafted to keep the government from getting between the constitution and the people. ( sorry bout my spelling errors) :rolleyes:

[merlin390]

Stupid people do stupid things.

Just remember, the second amendment was drafted to keep the government from getting between the constitution and the people.

Those are two of the smartest things I have heard today!!

[USMC850T]

Well starfish, he has a point. I grew up a Roman Catholic without any guidance in politics. My family raised me to believe that I would make my own decisions whether or not they are right or wrong. I grew out of that phase of believing in mulit-millennium old folklore. Plus, religion should have nothing to do with how we view politics. If you are truly by the books, you would know about separation of church and state.

Anyways, back to Iraq. How is that study going USMC850T?

I've got a 25 page paper getting between me and finishing the report. Hopefully ill be done with the paper tonight but we'll see.

Edited December 13, 2006 by USMC850T

[bottlecap]

starfish do you even know or understand what the term liberal means? i'll give you a hint: it's used incorrectly by a large portion of the population of this country (YOU), and about 90% of the U.S. population, if asked to describe themselves, would wind up falling into the category.

the core idea of liberalism, is that the market solves everything. liberalism is a kind of capitalism applied to thought and philosophy. the thinking is that if we create a free marketplace of ideas, where each is given equal consideration, and if we rationally process each one, then we will find the best and most truthful ideas. supply and demand of ideas so to speak. the demand for truth and knowledge will increase the use and belief of good ideas, and shun the use and belief of bad ones.

the problem with liberalism as it has progressed throughout the 20th century is that you can't create a real marketplace of ideas. the world is not yet globalized enough. people of different cultures have different spheres of ideas and every idea is not given equal consideration. the other major problem is that people like you don't think rationally.

to drive home this point if you answer yes to most of the following questions, congratulations, you're a liberal.

-do you believe that democracy or democratic republics are the best forms of government?

-do you believe that free capitalism is the best economic model?

-do you believe that individuals should be autonomous (do you believe that freedom is good)?

-do you believe that knowledge should be made available to everyone?

yay, we're all liberals. please stop using the word incorrectly. there are plenty of other terms you could use to more accurately describe what you intended to. thank you in advance.

-mike

[bottlecap]

as far as the report goes...

i think it's pretty amazing that nobody is talking about how remarkable it is that there had to be a study group in the first place. people in government used to be able to solve problems. instead they now make them for people outside of government to solve. it's true that most of the people who were part of the study group used to be in government... but then that's part of my point. seriously... we elect people to represent us, to solve problems, and to do their best not to make more for us. what do they do once they're elected? they pass the buck and shirk responsibility.

as far as the document itself, it only subtly points out something they should have screamed from the rooftops. what is that? that we screwed up way too much and for way too long for there to be an ideal solution to the mountain of problems in and with iraq. there was a reason we supported saddam when he first came to power. we thought he'd be a stabilizing force in the region, and he was extremely good at that. he used fear and murder to maintain peace within his own very divided country, he kept iran in check, gave us leverage against saudi arabia, and also gave the arab community an arab capable of helping to balance the isreal/palistine mess, while at the same time keeping the arab community reasonably divided on almost every other issue. thinking that a new democracy was going to be able to maintain that balance was foolish and against common sense. that's what the analysts told bush I and it's why he didn't invade. bush II decided to ignore that advise and analysis and look what happened.

most of their recommendations make sense. but if you ask me, we should get out of their and offer our formal apologies for screwing up the postwar occupation and transition so horribly. we should then offer the iraqi government any amount of financial and military assistance. everything we do in iraq from here out ought to be by invitation only, both military and economic actions. financial aid should go to the iraqi government and they can distribute it as needed, to american contractors or anyone else. will their be corruption? sure. but it seems our own contractors do a superb job of wasting taxpayer money so why not let the iraqis give it a try? there was recently an excellent presentation of a plan similar to this that would cut the cost of the war exponentially and save us a ton of money as well as lives.

we've also got to let them fight a civil war if they want to and need to fight it. most democracies have had one. let them. the nation needs to sort out it's own identity. we should also try and bring an end to the war as quickly as possible without allowing a new dictator to control the country and then deal with the resulting situation. if you ask me, the nation ought to be split up. the kurds want no part of a national iraqi government. they've been acting as a nation themselves too long for that, so let them have one. the south should also break away due to the ethnic difference. that would likely have the added bonus of weakening iran, as the southern separatist movement in that country would want to form a unified state from the two southern territories. middle iraq could become the first real and true arab democracy, and a success story for our idiotic attempt to bring democracy to people who aren't sure they want it.

ok. that's all for now.

-mike

[Greenchunks]

A new Nazi (muslim) regime is building here in the US as around the world. And make no mistake, this is a fact. History is about to repeat it's self again.

Are the Nazi Muslims rebuilding so they can kill the Neocon Jews? Wow, it all makes sense now. Adolf Mohammed will be our next leader, why didn't I think of that, he'll beat out Barak Obama or John McCain for sure. Well there ya have it folks through the combined knowledge of starfish and Dvolvoguy you know our next president and what will happen from 2008-12.

Oh Mike, well said.

[Spoony]

All these people will keep watching girls gone wild and stupid "reality tv" and follow the lies that are told on the major networks and Communist News Network, be comfortable the way things are and they will pay.

Just remember that the people who watch and support these television programs come from every political view. Liberals and conservatives alike.

[DVolvoguy850T5]

starfish do you even know or understand what the term liberal means? i'll give you a hint: it's used incorrectly by a large portion of the population of this country (YOU), and about 90% of the U.S. population, if asked to describe themselves, would wind up falling into the category.

the core idea of liberalism, is that the market solves everything. liberalism is a kind of capitalism applied to thought and philosophy. the thinking is that if we create a free marketplace of ideas, where each is given equal consideration, and if we rationally process each one, then we will find the best and most truthful ideas. supply and demand of ideas so to speak. the demand for truth and knowledge will increase the use and belief of good ideas, and shun the use and belief of bad ones.

the problem with liberalism as it has progressed throughout the 20th century is that you can't create a real marketplace of ideas. the world is not yet globalized enough. people of different cultures have different spheres of ideas and every idea is not given equal consideration. the other major problem is that people like you don't think rationally.

to drive home this point if you answer yes to most of the following questions, congratulations, you're a liberal.

-do you believe that democracy or democratic republics are the best forms of government?

-do you believe that free capitalism is the best economic model?

-do you believe that individuals should be autonomous (do you believe that freedom is good)?

-do you believe that knowledge should be made available to everyone?

yay, we're all liberals. please stop using the word incorrectly. there are plenty of other terms you could use to more accurately describe what you intended to. thank you in advance.

-mike

Well Mike,

The above is the technical definition of Liberalisem from what you say is correct, however it seems that most people that claim to be liberals seem to be Marxist socialists. IE: Hillary Clinton, Diane Pelosi, Barbra Boxer, Diane Fienstein, Teddy Kennidy, Charles Shumer etc...They are all "Liberals".

If we are using the term LIBERAL incorrectly maybe most "liberals" should change the stereo type.

In my opinion liberalization of the USA means to liberate its citizens of their constitution and independance. Seems to be the trend sense the 50's. Just like Robert Nash Baldwin in 1914 wanted to do.

The same sense of security that was felt in the late 30's is true today. Big trouble is brewing and ALL of the liberal Americans are sleeping or too busy commiting debotchery (sp?) to see what is going on.

It is a shame to see the people that are responsible for the Iraq Study Report are liberal and they will translate what they "think" is the right thing to do. ( Which is to scape goat and demonize Isreal and the US.)

At any rate history is repeating its self as we speak.

[Greenchunks]

Well Mike,

The above is the technical definition of Liberalisem from what you say is correct, however it seems that most people that claim to be liberals seem to be Marxist socialists. IE: Hillary Clinton, Diane Pelosi, Barbra Boxer, Diane Fienstein, Teddy Kennidy, Charles Shumer etc...They are all "Liberals".

If we are using the term LIBERAL incorrectly maybe most "liberals" should change the stereo type.

In my opinion liberalization of the USA means to liberate its citizens of their constitution and independance. Seems to be the trend sense the 50's. Just like Robert Nash Baldwin in 1914 wanted to do.

The same sense of security that was felt in the late 30's is true today. Big trouble is brewing and ALL of the liberal Americans are sleeping or too busy commiting debotchery (sp?) to see what is going on.

It is a shame to see the people that are responsible for the Iraq Study Report are liberal and they will translate what they "think" is the right thing to do. ( Which is to scape goat and demonize Isreal and the US.)

At any rate history is repeating its self as we speak.

I'm guessing you mean Nancy Pelosi, the Speaker of the House, and Kennedy? Lol, your opinion of what liberalzation means is noting more than a biased skewed interpretation of what you feel that more libearl politicians have been doing over time. Not at all what the term liberal or liberalism means. Liberate citizens of their independence? Ha! So that's why the REPUBLICANS passed the Patriot Act, which possibly violated more personal freedoms than any other single bill in history. Liberate from the constitution? So that's why the seperation of church and state is becoming more blurred, because of the liberals?

It's debauchery by the way. And liberals aren't the ones having gay encounters with little male interns. They're also not the ones who support priests molesting little boys. Just about the only thing they can even be accused of doing which could be seen as debaucherous is gay marriage (like Cheney's Daughter) which affects no one except gay people, so just let em be happy, they're not getting any tazzy already. And the other is abortion which I wont even go into with you nut-jobs because it's sure to end up bad. Just like the result of your parents copulating.

[DVolvoguy850T5]

I'm guessing you mean Nancy Pelosi, the Speaker of the House, and Kennedy? Lol, your opinion of what liberalzation means is noting more than a biased skewed interpretation of what you feel that more libearl politicians have been doing over time. Not at all what the term liberal or liberalism means. Liberate citizens of their independence? Ha! So that's why the REPUBLICANS passed the Patriot Act, which possibly violated more personal freedoms than any other single bill in history. Liberate from the constitution? So that's why the seperation of church and state is becoming more blurred, because of the liberals?

It's debauchery by the way. And liberals aren't the ones having gay encounters with little male interns. They're also not the ones who support priests molesting little boys. Just about the only thing they can even be accused of doing which could be seen as debaucherous is gay marriage (like Cheney's Daughter) which affects no one except gay people, so just let em be happy, they're not getting any pussy already. And the other is abortion which I wont even go into with you nut-jobs because it's sure to end up bad. Just like the result of your parents copulating.

That is fine that you can say that about me. Just like most liberals who have been liberated from history have to bash what I say. Yes, NANCY Pelosi ( I do not care how I put her name because they are all the same and have the same agenda.)

I am sorry about my spelling.

Maybe it is time for you to take a history course including world history Greenchunks!

The fool is the person who does not learn from history and is doomed to repete it.

Every country that has adopted abortion and homosexuality has doomed it self. Every one of them. History proves that. Why is it that it seems that MOST homosexuals are self declared liberals?

My interpretation of what is going on is baised completely on historical events in world history.

To embrace the guides of the ACLU is a death sentance.

One thing that is good about abortion and homosexuality is the people that commit such activity will eventualy die out and not be able to reproduce and commit the same activity again.

Like I said, I am sorry about my spelling Mr Greenchunks. I am not sorry about my "biased opinion".

[USMC850T]

When starfish says liberal, he is talking about liberals as in the American political ideology not Liberal Democracy as in the form of government. Maybe it's just me but I never the two concepts and given the context it was pretty clear what he meant.

Edited December 14, 2006 by USMC850T